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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
 Posted - 10/08/2005 : 05:56:39 AM
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| How exactly does it work? |
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mrschoolbus
Senior Member
USA
78 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2005 : 4:20:57 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by B. Busguy33
quote:
Does anyone actually have a DT570 in there RE?
You see a lot of California-spec'd IC REs equipped with this engine.
quote:
What is a transmission retarder? I've heard that term alot, but never knew what it was.
Basically, a retarder of any kind helps slow a vehicle with less use of the brakes.
The IC- RE has not been built with the new (2005) DT570 engine. There are many REs built for the west coast with the DT530 I6 engine. May never be a need for a DT570 in a School Bus application. |
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2005 : 4:45:48 PM
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quote:
The IC- RE has not been built with the new (2005) DT570 engine. There are many REs built for the west coast with the DT530 I6 engine. May never be a need for a DT570 in a School Bus application.
Oh, ok. Thanks for the information.
I just assumed that since the DT570 replaced the DT530 that the 570 would be spec'd by most IC RE customers in CA, since most of their IC REs had featured the 530. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2005 : 5:16:19 PM
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| I've seen atleast one bus on SBC that had a DT570 in it. I wonder what it would be like driving it? |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 02:54:50 AM
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| Anyone out there who has experiance with MBE engines, how would you rate those engines from a performance and a maintenance/repair standpoint? |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 2:23:55 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
Anyone out there who has experiance with MBE engines, how would you rate those engines from a performance and a maintenance/repair standpoint?
We have an 04 unit (now on it's third year in service) and 2 06 units that we got over the summer. From a performance standpoint they do good, fast acceleration and they can handle the hills quite well. From a maintenance/repair I've heard some people have had a few minor issues with them (no specifics) our first unit has not had any issues and it is now over two years old. Both of the new units are problem free so far.
The issue that has been discussed before is the lack of heat output from this engine in the winter. The engine runs cooler therefore in very cold weather it is not producing enough heat for the bus heaters. A solution was to install Webasto auxillary heaters on the buses. |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 3:20:00 PM
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Of these, which would you prefer from a performance and maintenance standpoint?
* International
* Cummins
* MBE
* CAT |
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722
Senior Member
United States
129 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 3:58:15 PM
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| MBE - Hands down. |
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 5:06:27 PM
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| My personal preference goes to the International engines. I do not maintain them, though, so I can't comment on that. I prefer the inline-6 diesel engines International produces over their V8s. |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 5:19:56 PM
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This is more the opinion of our mechanic than me, but here's our preference
1. MBE
2. International
3. CAT
We do not have Cummins in our fleet so I can't comment on them as we don't have experience with them. We have a few DT-466's in our fleet, they've done quite well for us although I've heard complaints on the forums about some problems with the newer ones. The DT-360 was a very good engine for our needs, they really were built to last. We've had pretty good luck with the 444, probalby a little better luck than what I've heard from some people. We've been very happy with the MBE and since we are buying all Thomas products (at least for now) we are specing the MBE engine. We have one CAT in our fleet, not the worst engine in the world, but not the best either.
My favorite engine is the International 345 but that has been out of production for a few years now.  |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2005 : 5:26:43 PM
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I heard some nasty things about CAT engines. We have 1997 and 1998 Thomas ER's with CAT engines and our mechanics always complain about them.
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2005 : 3:27:08 PM
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| Does anyone know if the International HT 570 is available in school buses? |
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
Posted - 11/28/2005 : 1:54:06 PM
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quote:
Does anyone know if the International HT 570 is available in school buses?
I don't believe it is. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2005 : 07:55:27 AM
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| Does anyone know where I can go online to find info on the Allison PTS 3000 Transmission that Blue Bird offers with the All American? I went to the Allison website, but couldn't find it. |
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informal
Active Member
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2005 : 11:51:13 AM
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| Cat hands down MBE a close second we run them all. |
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
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Wolf0r
Top Member
USA
2181 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2005 : 9:43:09 PM
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| I finally got to see a rear engine IC while I was out doing warranty work. My question is, how do you plan to work on this engine? I couldn't even see what was in there through that little door on the side, that pops back open on them often. The rear door is huge but all I saw was radiator. When he closed the rear door, the top middle of the door caught on the body and cracked the fiberglass. I'm glad I wasn't there for IC warranty work, sheesh those guys were cussing. |
“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
Neil deGrasse Tyson |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2005 : 02:43:20 AM
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| As much as I love AmTran and IC buses, that is one of the minor design flaws with them. Those side access panels are nice, but they are not enough. The new back panel that opens is nice too, but it needs to be like the rear panel of a Thomas. Where when you open it, you have the whole engine right there in front of you. You shouldn't have to take the radiator out to work on the engine. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 07:30:47 AM
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| Are MBE engines the only engines you can get in the current Thomas HDX, C2, and EF? |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 08:05:30 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
Are MBE engines the only engines you can get in the current Thomas HDX, C2, and EF?
Nope. Thomas gives you choice With the HDX I'm pretty sure you get a choice of three engines, the standard being the MBE 906 with either a CAT C7 or a Cummins ISC as options. My county is getting some HDXs this year and I'm willing to bet they will be ISC powered. The ISC is a wet-sleeve engine similar in concept to the DT466.
The C2 offers the MBE 906 of course and possibly even the MBE 904 which is a four cylinder engine. The CAT C7 is an option as far as I know. I'm not sure if there is a Cummins option for the C2 but if there is it would be the ISB.
As for the EF, I know the Cummins ISB WAS available with this bus for a long time. I imagine it still is but most of the recent ones I've seen either have the MBE 906 or the CAT C7. |
Edited by - GMCBlueBird83 on 12/04/2005 08:08:26 AM |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 08:07:38 AM
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| So the only company of IC, BB, and Thomas without a big choice in engines is IC? As far I know they only offer the VT365, DT466, and DT570 with there buses. |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 08:18:39 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
So the only company of IC, BB, and Thomas without a big choice in engines is IC? As far I know they only offer the VT365, DT466, and DT570 with there buses.
Is the 570 still available for the bus line? I was not aware of that. But as to your question, that would seem to be the case. Blue Bird and Thomas give you choice of the engine manufacturer while IC only gives you International engines. Thomas gives you the most choice, with three different engine manufacturers. |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 08:20:22 AM
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Blue Bird engine choices are as follows for each model...
Vision - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
FE - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
RE - Cat C7, Cummins ISB, Cummins ISC, John Deere CNG
Thomas is as follows:
C2 - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906
FS65 - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906
EF - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
HDX - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906, Cummins ISC, John Deere CNG
*Blue Bird will not start putting Cummins into the Vision and FE until early next year. |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 08:29:25 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard
Blue Bird engine choices are as follows for each model...
Vision - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
FE - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
RE - Cat C7, Cummins ISB, Cummins ISC, John Deere CNG
Thomas is as follows:
C2 - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906
FS65 - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906
EF - Cat C7, Cummins ISB
HDX - Cat C7, MBE 904, MBE 906, Cummins ISC, John Deere CNG
*Blue Bird will not start putting Cummins into the Vision and FE until early next year.
Thanks for the corrections Rich. I was not aware you could spec an HDX with an MBE 904! And as usual, I totally forgot about the CNG option. |
Edited by - GMCBlueBird83 on 12/04/2005 08:33:01 AM |
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Wolf0r
Top Member
USA
2181 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2005 : 8:38:01 PM
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| I am glad Bluebird offers the Cummins now. They just need to do something with that grille. We painted all of ours with argent paint. More choices in engines is great for those who are already set up for CAT or Cummins. Thomas is ok too but I don't like their electrial systems. Hey if you like the International that's great too. They just need to work the bugs out of the bodies and make it a little easier to service. I do work on other busses besides Bluebird. |
“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
Neil deGrasse Tyson |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 02:16:50 AM
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| That is nice that Blue Bird ad Thomas offer all these options. I do like the International engines, but I could some could benefit from a larger choice of engines in the IC buses. |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 05:21:33 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
That is nice that Blue Bird ad Thomas offer all these options. I do like the International engines, but I could some could benefit from a larger choice of engines in the IC buses.
IC does have one thing in their favor however. If you want a wet-sleeve engine but prefer either a conventional or a front engine, IC is the only way to go assuming the Blue Bird International is no longer available. I imagine the Cummins ISC is too large to fit under the hood of a conventional and perhaps the engine bay of an FE. |
Edited by - GMCBlueBird83 on 12/05/2005 05:22:20 AM |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 07:11:16 AM
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There is the Blue Bird on the International 3300 Chassis. I believe that is offered with the International engines. I'm not sure what else you get, as far as engines go.
What kind of transmissions do Thomas, BB, and IC offer in there buses? |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 09:21:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
There is the Blue Bird on the International 3300 Chassis. I believe that is offered with the International engines. I'm not sure what else you get, as far as engines go.
What kind of transmissions do Thomas, BB, and IC offer in there buses?
If the Blue Bird International 3300 is still available it would offer the DT466 as well as the VT365. There was talk about Blue Bird no longer offering this bus, however a check at the the Blue Bird website still lists the 3300 as being available. But the site is not updated often so who knows, LOL
I'll save the tranny answer for somebody else since I can't recall the new model numbers. |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 11:18:24 AM
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The transmission options are the Allison PTS 2500 and PTS 3000. The 2500 replaces the A-2000, and the 3000 replaces the MD-3060.
Freightliner is offering Mercedes transmissions in their medium-duty trucks, it was mentioned once in an article a while back that they would eventually be offered in the Thomas Built products. |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 11:44:01 AM
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| The MD-3060 is no longer made? or is it not availiable in BB's only? As I've said several times, I don't know much about this engine and transmission stuff. |
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GMCBlueBird83
Top Member
USA
1478 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 1:41:49 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
The MD-3060 is no longer made? or is it not availiable in BB's only? As I've said several times, I don't know much about this engine and transmission stuff.
Well, the PTS 3000(Thanks for repsonding Bret) is not much different if at all from the 3060, just a new name to confuse as all |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 4:00:02 PM
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| Why is it that companies take a product and change it's name? I don't see the point of it. |
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IC-RE
Top Member
USA
4117 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 4:57:05 PM
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| Just like Internationals 7.3L and the T444E, they are much the same right? |
 bus 1980, a 2008 IC RE 300 for Fairfax County Public Schools, Fairfax, Virginia. |
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78fordwayne
Top Member
USA
2868 Posts |
Posted - 12/05/2005 : 7:56:12 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC-RE
Just like Internationals 7.3L and the T444E, they are much the same right?
The only thing that is really the same would be the size of the engine it self. The 7.3 was a basic non electronic engine with indirect injection. Also the 7.3 didnt come with a turbo standard. It was an option in 93 and 94.
The T444E is electronic engine with direct injection and hydraulic injectors.No injection pump like older diesels. |
Robert B.
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Engine & Transmission Questions
