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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
 Posted - 09/04/2019 : 04:04:55 AM
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Getting a 641 12 and 13 code. Guessing actuator is bad. Any way to install new one without computer and Cummins software? 75 mile trip to dealer with the buzzer blaring won't be fun.....
Thanks all!! |
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Bluenozer
Top Member
Canada
650 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2019 : 05:14:06 AM
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| Just replace the whole unit as one (turbo with pre installed actuator) you insite or jpro to install an actuator and more then likely it will come back if you do just an actuator been there too many times do it once and do it with a complete package |
OEM trained in wiring and all engine platforms for over 20 years
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2019 : 07:25:17 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
Just replace the whole unit as one (turbo with pre installed actuator) you insite or jpro to install an actuator and more then likely it will come back if you do just an actuator been there too many times do it once and do it with a complete package
If its still under warranty I bet this is how it IH repairs it. Might be the way I go also.
Electronics on a turbo.................... |
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2019 : 11:18:52 AM
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Anyone know off the top of their head what the warranty is from Cummins? 5 years or 100k? Is the turbo/vgt actuator covered?
Thanks all!! |
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willism
Advanced Member
United States
250 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2019 : 11:57:15 AM
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| Should be like you said 5yrs 100k and its covered with my stuff. |
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2019 : 12:28:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
Just replace the whole unit as one (turbo with pre installed actuator) you insite or jpro to install an actuator and more then likely it will come back if you do just an actuator been there too many times do it once and do it with a complete package
So is the VGT on the turbo combo ready to go without the calibrations and needed sweep test after install?
Plug and run so to speak? Likely my cheapest option as they want my first born just for a service call to come to me and calibrate the VGT...
Thanks!!! |
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partsman_ba
Administrator
United States
377 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2019 : 12:46:54 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by CISDbusman
quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
Just replace the whole unit as one (turbo with pre installed actuator) you insite or jpro to install an actuator and more then likely it will come back if you do just an actuator been there too many times do it once and do it with a complete package
So is the VGT on the turbo combo ready to go without the calibrations and needed sweep test after install?
Plug and run so to speak? Likely my cheapest option as they want my first born just for a service call to come to me and calibrate the VGT...
Thanks!!!
No, you'll need to calibrate with InSite either way. |
"Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional." |
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/09/2019 : 12:48:05 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by partsman_ba
quote:
Originally posted by CISDbusman
quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
Just replace the whole unit as one (turbo with pre installed actuator) you insite or jpro to install an actuator and more then likely it will come back if you do just an actuator been there too many times do it once and do it with a complete package
So is the VGT on the turbo combo ready to go without the calibrations and needed sweep test after install?
GRRRR!! Thanks a zillion though!!
Plug and run so to speak? Likely my cheapest option as they want my first born just for a service call to come to me and calibrate the VGT...
Thanks!!!
No, you'll need to calibrate with InSite either way.
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Bluenozer
Top Member
Canada
650 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 08:24:48 AM
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| if the actuator is pre installed on turbo no calibration is needed at all it is done at factory it is plug and run it |
OEM trained in wiring and all engine platforms for over 20 years
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partsman_ba
Administrator
United States
377 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 08:37:51 AM
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Think about it this way - the ECM needs to know what values the sensor registers so it can accurately close the gate, open it wide, and set it at say 40%. They apparently don't have very good quality control on the sensor, so they teach the computer what is what. And even when you purchase the whole magilla, you're still getting a new sensor.
Do you possibly have someone with InSite closer to you than the dealer? We do repairs for a bunch of small school districts in our area so they can afford to keep their busing in-house rather than jumping to First Student. |
"Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional." |
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Bluenozer
Top Member
Canada
650 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 09:10:56 AM
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vgt actuator is really for regens for it can overstroke the turbo to aid in the production of heat to help burn the extra fuel inwhich the injectors spray on the exhaust stroke( since emissions started they've used turbos with actuators and got rid of waste gate turbos) and where it fails(turbo) is in the overstroke area builds up washboards(like a dirt road) and the actuator can't move it so it burns out actuator
and its a stepper motor really not classified as a sensor for it to be a sensor one of the wires would called a return or signal
simple trick just plug in new turbo(complete with actuator that came preinstalled) see if it logs a code before you waste your money on a service call
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OEM trained in wiring and all engine platforms for over 20 years
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 09:56:12 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by partsman_ba
Do you possibly have someone with InSite closer to you than the dealer? We do repairs for a bunch of small school districts in our area so they can afford to keep their busing in-house rather than jumping to First Student.
That was kinda my next thought/option. Pull the turbo off the bus that is down, load it and the new VGT up on a running sister bus and drive it to a nearby District or Independant shop and have them do the VGT calibration off the turbo using the running bus and then install the VGT and have them run the sweep test then reinstall complete assy back on my bus that is down.
Poor men have poor ways.....:-) |
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CISDbusman
Advanced Member
306 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 09:59:47 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
vgt actuator is really for regens for it can overstroke the turbo to aid in the production of heat to help burn the extra fuel inwhich the injectors spray on the exhaust stroke( since emissions started they've used turbos with actuators and got rid of waste gate turbos) and where it fails(turbo) is in the overstroke area builds up washboards(like a dirt road) and the actuator can't move it so it burns out actuator
and its a stepper motor really not classified as a sensor for it to be a sensor one of the wires would called a return or signal
simple trick just plug in new turbo(complete with actuator that came preinstalled) see if it logs a code before you waste your money on a service call
Might be another option. Hate to spend the extra coin for a turbo until I have exhausted all other options. Turbo combo will still be a lot cheaper than having IH do it!!
Thanks all!! |
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partsman_ba
Administrator
United States
377 Posts |
Posted - 09/10/2019 : 10:35:03 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenozer
and its a stepper motor really not classified as a sensor for it to be a sensor one of the wires would called a return or signal
That's not correct. There are four wires - 12V power, ground, and two data lines. Here's the description from Cummins:
Circuit Description
The VGT is electronically activated by the VGT actuator. The VGT actuator is a smart device that receives information via the J1939 data link from the primary engine ECM. The VGT actuator performs its own diagnostics and reports errors back to the primary engine control module (ECM) with the J1939 data link. |
"Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional." |
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Bluenozer
Top Member
Canada
650 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2019 : 09:21:35 AM
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the turbo speed sensor is what tells the actuator what to do
yes the actuator has a position sensor (reason why it sets a code) but the actuator is nothing more then a motor that does what another sensor tells it to do
during regen the doc inlet also contributes to the movement of the actuator to over stroke for heat
just hook up calterm and go through all parameters that control VGT position , or hook up and delete the vgt and see everything that needs to be changed (i've got years doing deletes) you really understand the regen system after looking at all the parameters that are involved |
OEM trained in wiring and all engine platforms for over 20 years
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Cummins 6.7 VGT actuator.
