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 2009 vision red and amber lights
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/23/2013 :  6:51:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have a 2009 vision that the weldon flasher shorted out at the right amber blade terminal. I replaced the flasher and now when the master switch is activated the reds come on only. I can disconnect the reds and plug the ambers in those locations and the ambers will come on. So I know the lights are good. I tried a spare master and door switch but same results. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
thanks maxx

Tb4020
Senior Member

United States
65 Posts

Posted - 09/24/2013 :  03:46:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Do you have your wires plugged in correctly? There is a spot that says flash red whenever door is open and one that says flash red only after yellow. Maybe got the wires reversed?
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/24/2013 :  05:05:58 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have double checked that, It was doing this when it came in with the wire burning smell and I turned the master on the reds came on immediately. The system was working properly when it went out on the route.
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slippert
Advanced Member

USA
383 Posts

Posted - 09/24/2013 :  07:59:11 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Just a thought .... do you have your master switch wire hooked to master sw/term 2 or term 1 for override? Mine have a master switch wire hooked to term 2 and a overhead light start switch hooked to term 8, both switches are side by side on the dash... sounds like a couple wires on Weldon flasher are not hooked in correct spots if lights activate with Master switch.?.?. especially if you can switch amber and red light wires and the problem switches colors.

We have a master switch that must be on to make overheads work, then second switch to start them going amber, then when door opens reds come on...


If all wiring hooked correctly you might want to scout for other melted/shorted wires...
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/24/2013 :  7:36:46 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have the master switch also and the start switch. I switched the last two wires and still get the reds come on when i turn on the master and when i open and close the door they go off. when i press the start button the reds are still the ones that come on. Got to be missing something simple.
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Tb4020
Senior Member

United States
65 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  03:50:48 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
manual door or air door?
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slippert
Advanced Member

USA
383 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  08:44:49 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I am still leaning toward what Tb4020 said in first post... are you feeding power from your master switch to the override term#1 on weldon flasher when you turn it on? otherwise unless u had a melt down in wiring somewhere, master switch shouldn't activate any overhead lights... should just power up that circuit/flasher, so you can activate lights with W/L start switch, that feeds term#8 on flasher...

If like mind the master sw should feed term #2 on weldon flasher only, no wire hooked on override terminal #1... I am pretty sure if you are feeding master sw to override term#1 lights will do exactly what you are saying they are.. according to my State inspectors in MI the override feature is not legal...so isn't wired for it.

How about your grd wire on flasher? incorrect or bad grd can make all kinds of odd things happen..

Edited by - slippert on 09/25/2013 08:50:09 AM
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2319 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  09:40:00 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think something is going on with your Weldon unit. I'm wondering what made the first unit melt. Maybe the problem in your system is still there & affected this unit but didn't melt it. Another idea is that your Weldon is receiving a ground signal at the door switch terminal.

Bryan
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  2:34:57 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have the manual door on this one. this unit did not have a ground wire to the flasher ground terminal I added to see if it would help but did not help. I do not think that the wiring for the ambers is bad from the flasher back because I can put the amber leads on the reds and the ambers will flash at all four corners. I checked the 1 and 2 terminals I did have the master switch wired to 2. I do get the 12 volts from the start switch when is pressed down to the flasher, When I hook the ambers into the reds terminals the sleeping child check system does activate when the ambers come on. It acts like the door switch is not working but I did try a different door switch in the beginning because of the way it was acting up because if you hit the master with the door open it will do the same thing.
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  3:49:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I also took a spare light and hooked it up to the amber terminal to eleminate the wiring in the bus and light hooked directly to the flasher did not work either.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2319 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  4:11:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I don't think you're getting a signal from your door switch for some reason. I can't remember and I'm at home(having trouble with the computer at work) but I think the door switch completes the ground circuit when it's open. So if that's true check the ground at the door switch.

Bryan
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2013 :  8:19:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have tried a different switch added another ground wire no change. Does seem to be like the door switch is not working because when I open the door and close it they stop,
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Tb4020
Senior Member

United States
65 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  08:14:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Do you have a wire on terminal #1? What happens if leave terminal #9&10 unplugged and turn on the master switch? Something is telling the board to turn the reds on. The door circuit is working if it's signaling to turn off it's breaking the loop. When it makes the ground it activates when you close the door it breaks turning off the board, or by using the master cutting 12V supply. If you have an override switch leave it unplugged from term. #1 and try it. If you had a short to ground (wire to the door switch) it wouldn't cancel when shutting the door it would stay running unless you killed 12V supply to the board via master switch. Be sure power isn't back feeding from the stop arm wire.
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slippert
Advanced Member

USA
383 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  11:08:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Tb4020

Do you have a wire on terminal #1? What happens if leave terminal #9&10 unplugged and turn on the master switch? Something is telling the board to turn the reds on. The door circuit is working if it's signaling to turn off it's breaking the loop. When it makes the ground it activates when you close the door it breaks turning off the board, or by using the master cutting 12V supply. If you have an override switch leave it unplugged from term. #1 and try it. If you had a short to ground (wire to the door switch) it wouldn't cancel when shutting the door it would stay running unless you killed 12V supply to the board via master switch. Be sure power isn't back feeding from the stop arm wire.



Ditto.......
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  1:16:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ok almost there,We do not use the #1 terminal, I left the #10 wire off and I can turn the master on and nothing, press the start and the ambers come on as expected, open the door and the reds come on as expected, close the door and all lights off. Reopen door and nothing, The reds should come back on probably # 10s function. Would that be the green wire with black stripe wire on the door switch. trying to trace it but the bluebird schematic page only shows the blue and white wires. Is tbe green wire a ground circuit also.
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  1:18:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ok almost there,We do not use the #1 terminal, I left the #10 wire off and I can turn the master on and nothing, press the start and the ambers come on as expected, open the door and the reds come on as expected, close the door and all lights off. Reopen door and nothing, The reds should come back on probably # 10s function. Would that be the green wire with black stripe wire on the door switch. trying to trace it but the bluebird schematic page only shows the blue and white wires. Is tbe green wire a ground circuit also.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2319 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  4:48:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by maxx62

Ok almost there,We do not use the #1 terminal, I left the #10 wire off and I can turn the master on and nothing, press the start and the ambers come on as expected, open the door and the reds come on as expected, close the door and all lights off. Reopen door and nothing, The reds should come back on probably # 10s function. Would that be the green wire with black stripe wire on the door switch. trying to trace it but the bluebird schematic page only shows the blue and white wires. Is tbe green wire a ground circuit also.



You don't want it to start the sequence over again w/o pushing start button do you? Unless your state is different than mine. Which is possible.

Bryan
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2013 :  7:44:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
With our buses, If you leave the master on and open the door again without hitting the start switch the reds come on. my door switches are four wire.
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Tb4020
Senior Member

United States
65 Posts

Posted - 09/27/2013 :  03:36:40 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There shouldn't be a wire on 9&10 at the same time. If the door switch is hooked to 10 when ever you open the door and the master is on the reds will flash, if hooked to 9 the ambers will come on with the start switch and reds after the door is open. The way you are describing it by unhooking 10 the system board is functioning properly. The door switches are four wire, overhead ground circuit (2 wires) and step light circuit (2 wires) the step light has 12 volts overhead circuit is a ground loop. I don't know how it's going to do what you want it to do, how does it know of the door is opened the first or second time? Think maybe you have some extra wires hooked up by mistake. Some of ours have an override switch that make the reds come on whether the door is open or not but they're hooked to term. #1. Did your old board have a splitter terminal at #9 so you have an extra wire that maybe got hooked to #10? When you put your new board in make sure and mount it either vertical or with the blades pointing down, we had many short out that the blades were pointing up (moisture, salt, etc.).
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maxx62
Senior Member

United States
106 Posts

Posted - 09/27/2013 :  1:02:23 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The wires were facing up. when I installed the new switch I pulled one wire at a time and plugged into new switch,The first and last terminals were the only ones without a wire plugged to it. I noticed that the other bus like it has the switch terminals facing down and will install the new switch facing down also. Thanks for all the help.,
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matts4290
Advanced Member

220 Posts

Posted - 09/28/2013 :  5:19:19 PM  Show Profile  Visit matts4290's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Here's what I noticed. You said it did not have a ground wire and you added one. Pins 9 and 10 should not BOTH have wires. If it is the same as the older traditional system, when the door opens, it closes the circuit to ground, and the flasher gets a ground on pin 9 or 10. Closed door opens the circuit and the flasher sees infinite resistance.

This may help too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K30Fai7b5z0

matts4290

Edit: I'm thinking the wires at 9 and 10 are your "missing" ground and your door trigger. If this is correct, only one of them will show constant ground and the other only when the door is open.

We can't all be conventional!
http://www.youtube.com/user/matts4290

Edited by - matts4290 on 09/28/2013 5:30:06 PM
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Thomasbus24
Administrator

USA
3336 Posts

Posted - 09/29/2013 :  3:01:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by matts4290

Pins 9 and 10 should not BOTH have wires.


They sometimes do...in fact nearly all my birds are that way. One of the wires simply terminates in an unknown location. Why they did it that way I'll never understand.
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