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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
 Posted - 04/29/2010 : 5:06:54 PM
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2000 AmTran RE - International T444E 210HP - Allison MT643 5-Speed Auto
Bus operates at a temperature of 210. Fan clutch is almost always engaged. The loud roar from the engine is quite annoying. Other buses in the fleet of the same specs rarely have their fan clutch kick on.
What may be the problem? |
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hardybusman
Advanced Member
United States
470 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2010 : 7:00:44 PM
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| Either your bus is running on the hot side causing the clutch to stay ingaged or a faulty clutch. The fan clutch running all the time is really hard on the water pump so I'd get it checked out. |
Mr. Courtney Hardy
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baptistbusman1
Senior Member
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2010 : 7:24:19 PM
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Does this run non stop? Like when you start it up and drive it a mile, is it on the entire time or just when it's running around 210?
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I was formally Baptistbusman. However, I lost my password, and had not updated my email address.
Here is a link to my old posts. http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/forum/search.asp?mode=DoIt&MEMBER_ID=1846 |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 04/30/2010 : 01:47:22 AM
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| It kicks on when the temperature hits about 200 and stays on all the time. It doesn't turn off unless the temp dips below 200 which doesn't ever happen when driving. |
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JustinB
Advanced Member
United States
490 Posts |
Posted - 04/30/2010 : 05:15:41 AM
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| Make sure that your cooling system & charge air cooler aren't cemented in with road debris. Rear engines can act like large vaccum cleaners. |
I may not know the answer but I can usually find who does. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2010 : 06:51:03 AM
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| Ok. This bus has had this issue for about 2+ years now according to the previous two assigned drivers of the bus. This school year, the bus has broken down twice with coolant issues. The first incident was a hose from the overflow tank burst, and the second incident involved having the entire heater lines from the engine to the front heater core replaced. Would this possibly be related to the fan clutch issue or just isolated incidents? |
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baptistbusman1
Senior Member
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2010 : 08:34:07 AM
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Well you can't just let stuff go til a hose blows out, proper pm inspections probably would have noticed a bad looking hose or two.
It probably needs new coolant and a new thermostat. |
I was formally Baptistbusman. However, I lost my password, and had not updated my email address.
Here is a link to my old posts. http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/forum/search.asp?mode=DoIt&MEMBER_ID=1846 |
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mastertech
Advanced Member
274 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2010 : 4:33:21 PM
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| AMtram RE's . Oh yeh good times. First off does it have the new upgraded radiator and aftercooler? It was a service bulliten/recall I believe many moons ago. The replacement ones are less prone to plugging with dirt. RE's should run at fan on/off temp since they have no ram airflow . Thermostats can also stick half open cause an overheating issue. One thing we have noticed recently is every hose on an RE that is 10 years old and older need to be replaced because they will fail . Just bite the bullet and bring them in for total replacement of all heater,upper and lowers. Be sure the lowers dont rub on the frame. |
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Cal Mc
Advanced Member
303 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2010 : 9:19:52 PM
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| We had a similar problem with a C7 Cat blowing hoses. The problem was diesel in the cooling system caused by a faulty injector seat. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2010 : 05:49:36 AM
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| The heater hose issues have been resolved. The fan clutch constantly staying on is still an issue. From what I gather, a faulty thermostat or faulty fan clutch itself may be to blame. |
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hardybusman
Advanced Member
United States
470 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2010 : 3:43:02 PM
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| Is it that load even with the engine in the rear? I've never really driven a rear engine bus but a conventional is annoying. How does the fan mount on a rear engine? Is it remote mounted? |
Mr. Courtney Hardy
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2010 : 5:33:50 PM
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| Oh yeah! It's loud. Sounds like a Boeing 747 on take-off! I believe the fan itself is directly connected to the engine, since the cooling fan is dead-center on the back of the bus. I'll have to look at the bus more closely. |
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hardybusman
Advanced Member
United States
470 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2010 : 6:34:12 PM
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| I was wondering how you worked the engine like that. I thought they were remote mounted to the side but like I said I'm a conventional person. |
Mr. Courtney Hardy
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Thomas Ford 85-16
Top Member
USA
4177 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2010 : 07:59:11 AM
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| Hardy, AmTran REs and IC REs have the engine fan mounted to the engine in a traditional manner like a conventional. You'll notice on all but the most recent AmTran and IC REs, the grille is in the dead center of the rear panel of the bus. Thomas and Blue Bird REs though have remote mounted fans and radiators that breath through panels on either side of the bus. To my knowledge, those fans are driven electrically or hydraulically (power steering system). |
Mike's Bus Yard - http://buses.zwebpages.com - Since 1999
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hardybusman
Advanced Member
United States
470 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2010 : 4:03:01 PM
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| In that case ICRE1629 you should get it checked out. The fan running hard all the time will wear out the water pump. |
Mr. Courtney Hardy
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2010 : 2:07:57 PM
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Hello. I wanted to bring this topic back with some more detailed information. I was able to drive the bus in question myself before school ended and paid special attention to the behavior of the fan clutch.
Starting out with a cold bus, I drove a few miles and the water temp reached approximately 190 degrees and the fan clutch engaged. The fan clutch did not dis-engage until I shut the bus off when I parked it for the night. The bus operates at roughly 205-210 degrees normally, just like almost all of our other 1999-2001 AmTran RE's with the same specifications.
This bus is due for scheduled service later this month. I intend to ask the garage to check and replace the fan clutch and thermostat, with hopes this may resolve the issue.
According to the previous two assigned drivers of this bus, the fan clutch has had this problem for at least two years, possibly longer.
Again, the bus is a 2000 AmTran RE, 78 Pax with a T444E-210HP & MT643 5-Speed Auto.
Any further suggestions/advice is much appreciated. |
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80 grit
Active Member
United States
47 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2010 : 5:18:03 PM
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| Sounds as if the fan clutch is working, it is on a little low though.Has the fan switch been looked at? I am leaning toward the motor running a bit warm keeping it on. Keep us posted, Erik |
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BJ Henderson
Advanced Member
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2010 : 01:09:17 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC RE 1629
Hello. I wanted to bring this topic back with some more detailed information. I was able to drive the bus in question myself before school ended and paid special attention to the behavior of the fan clutch.
Starting out with a cold bus, I drove a few miles and the water temp reached approximately 190 degrees and the fan clutch engaged. The fan clutch did not dis-engage until I shut the bus off when I parked it for the night. The bus operates at roughly 205-210 degrees normally, just like almost all of our other 1999-2001 AmTran RE's with the same specifications.
This bus is due for scheduled service later this month. I intend to ask the garage to check and replace the fan clutch and thermostat, with hopes this may resolve the issue.
I would ask the garage to diagnose the problem. Tell them as much info as you have on the bus when driving. Communicate directly with the technician if possible. Don't tell them it is the thermostat and fan clutch! All you have is what you hear see and feel on the road, and now, you read these forums. Don't assume cause Joe Crankshaft's bus did it, yours is too!
Remember, this is a 10 y/o bus you are driving and the mechanics see a lot of problems that may or may not be what you are driving. The worst thing you can do is tell them what to replace. Let them figure it out. I have my thoughts on the cooling system too.
According to the previous two assigned drivers of this bus, the fan clutch has had this problem for at least two years, possibly longer.
Again, the bus is a 2000 AmTran RE, 78 Pax with a T444E-210HP & MT643 5-Speed Auto.
Any further suggestions/advice is much appreciated.
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CMTT,CMAT,CMBT |
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jwreaume
Active Member
43 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 10:56:37 AM
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First recommendation, which you may have already done - verify that the sensor for coolant temp matches the actual at the thermostat housing (i.e. infrared thermometer.) Second - wash out the CAC and radiator with a garden hose top remove clogged debris. Third - Have someone copnnect to the ECM with a laptop or pro-link and see if the fan is being commanded on AND off. Possibly the fan may be coming on when it is supposed to, but not shutting off (i.e. the fan control solenoid may not be functioning properly.)
Just some ideas...
Let us know where you get with it.
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17 years in the truck & bus world, 10 years at an IH Dealer, ASE Certified Master Medium & Heavy Truck Technician and Advanced Level Diesel Engine Diagnostic Specialist, IH Diamond Certified 5 Times, Instructor of Apprentice Techs in Engines, Fuels, Electrical & Electronics.
Ask anything, I likely will have the answer, or at least a believable lie for ya...
120 Units, 5 Bays, 5 Techs, Living the dream baby... |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 07/13/2010 : 2:47:36 PM
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Ok, so I picked the bus up from the shop today. She runs great!!!!
Here's what our mechanics did:
- Replace thermostat and housing. Housing was damaged, needed to cut and drill out bolts to remove it.
- Replace relay for cooling fan
- Replace broken/missing blade on cooling fan
- Clean after cooler and radiator
- Top off all fluids
- Road test to verify normal on/off operation of fan clutch
I took the long way back to the yard from the shop to test the operation of the bus under various conditions. She's runs beautifully now! |
Edited by - IC RE 1629 on 07/13/2010 5:24:36 PM |
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lorenzalizares
New Member
4 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2011 : 6:42:52 PM
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Hi, I have a fan clutch on my '65 327/350 that I bought at NAPA. It works fine but I noticed that the shaft is shorter than the factory original. The longer shaft on the original allows the fan to be closer to the radiator, which helps cooling. Does anyone know if the fan clutches sold from Ecklers etc have this longer shaft? Does anyone know where to get the "correct" one? many thanks!
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Topic |
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Fan Clutch Problem
