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busdrver4jesus
Top Member
USA
802 Posts |
 Posted - 08/08/2006 : 5:38:29 PM
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I know that you are going to think that I am about to preach to the choir, but here goes anyway!
I was watching the Blue Bird Vision video on their web site, and I noticed something unsafe.
Go watch the video. At the beginning you will see an unsafe practice, and also at the end.
See if you notice, and I will come back later and let you know what I saw.
Nothing bad on Blue Bird's part, but when you are a school bus driver, you tend to notice things.
Video Here http://www.blue-bird.com/products/school/vision.php |
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78fordwayne
Top Member
USA
2868 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 5:49:02 PM
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I dont get it  |
Robert B.
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bus724
Top Member
USA
1609 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 6:08:03 PM
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| Something about the steering technique? Hand-over-hand's a no-no, at least where I drive... |
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kd4jfd
Top Member
USA
1168 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 6:30:11 PM
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| In the beginning, the driver does not perform the student crossing correctly. |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 6:31:22 PM
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| I'm not sure I'm spotting anything? |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 6:32:12 PM
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Driver doesn't use the ambers at the end, just the reds... haha. Although gotta remember, this is a cheesy promo video, so it doesn't matter!  |
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Bus9709
Top Member
USA
751 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 6:44:23 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard
...Although gotta remember, this is a cheesy promo video, so it doesn't matter!
LOL! That's true. And I also noticed the driver not using the ambers. |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 7:16:09 PM
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| Ummm...how does one skip the ambers? Only way I can think of is opening the door before hitting the traffic light switch... |
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dem84skeeprollinup
Top Member
USA
888 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 8:23:57 PM
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I know in our district and i'm sure many others, the pupil has to wait for the signal of the driver to approach the bus whether crossing the street or on the same side as the entrance door.
I don't think i saw the promo driver do that.
But of course, its just a promo! |
Do the world a favor and bring back GMC and Ford conventional chassis......
 
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 8:25:53 PM
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1. Driver does not make sure students wait in front of the bus before being signaled to cross the street. Either that, the students didn't listen.
2. The driver uses "hand-over-hand" to steer the bus, rather than the "push-and-pull" method.
3. Ambers were not used before making a stop. |
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NewBee Driver
Senior Member
USA
191 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 8:28:26 PM
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| in many states a "red overide" switch is required, which allows you to activate the red lights without the use of the door or activating the ambers. It is how we are trained to activate the red. that way the door remains closed until traffic is fully stoped. I have driven in another state where it was not availible and i hated it. i want my door closed until i see that cars are not going anywere. |
Driving Seattle To School - And Loving It!! |
Edited by - NewBee Driver on 08/08/2006 8:34:44 PM |
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dem84skeeprollinup
Top Member
USA
888 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 8:30:40 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by NewBee Driver
in many states a "red overide" switch is required, which allows you to activate the red lights without the use of the door or activating the ambers.
Yeah, our units have them and it is designated as an emergency amber switch. |
Do the world a favor and bring back GMC and Ford conventional chassis......
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OperationsM
Top Member
USA
515 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 08:47:26 AM
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| He did not let kids off near the curb, but right in the middle of the parking lot? |
Hotel's Ford Girardin |
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bus724
Top Member
USA
1609 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 08:57:28 AM
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quote:
Ummm...how does one skip the ambers?
There seems to be some confusion about the way warning lights operate, so let me see if I can clarify...
There are two modes on every electronic flasher: Sequential, and Non-Sequential.
In Sequential mode, the amber lights must flash before the reds during normal operation; open the door without the ambers on and the reds stay off. With the door open, press the amber switch, and the reds will start to flash. An optional red override will bypass this and turn the reds on immediately.
In Non-Sequential mode, the reds will activate any time the door is open (provided the master switch is on). Period. It doesn't matter if the ambers are turned on or not, open the door and the reds flash. An override switch may also be provided, but is only necessary with air/electric door.
Different state specs dictate which mode must be used on buses in that state. |
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Thomasfan89
Top Member
USA
1155 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 09:41:23 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by B. Busguy33
1. Driver does not make sure students wait in front of the bus before being signaled to cross the street. Either that, the students didn't listen.
2. The driver uses "hand-over-hand" to steer the bus, rather than the "push-and-pull" method.
3. Ambers were not used before making a stop.
Why is the hand-over-hand a no-no? A friend of mine who will be training me for my Ohio CDL told me its always hand over hand... Maybe it's an Ohio thing??? Just wondering. Plus, what is the "push-and-pull"? Thanks!
Greg |
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bus724
Top Member
USA
1609 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 09:53:50 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasfan89
Why is the hand-over-hand a no-no? A friend of mine who will be training me for my Ohio CDL told me its always hand over hand... Maybe it's an Ohio thing??? Just wondering. Plus, what is the "push-and-pull"? Thanks!
It might be just a state specific thing. Here in CT, you are not allowed to have either hand cross the center of the wheel, so you have to kind of push-pull-push-pull-push-pull...it seems hard at first if you're used to hand-over-hand, but you get used to it. The technique's also called the "shuffle".
As for why they do this? I don't really know, maybe they're worried you'll hurt your wrist by getting your arms tangled up together or something. |
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B. Busguy33
Top Member
USA
3444 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 10:41:29 AM
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quote:
It might be just a state specific thing. Here in CT, you are not allowed to have either hand cross the center of the wheel, so you have to kind of push-pull-push-pull-push-pull...it seems hard at first if you're used to hand-over-hand, but you get used to it. The technique's also called the "shuffle".
MA commercial vehicle drivers (including school bus drivers) are also required to use the "push-pull" method when driving, as Phil described. I thought this was a federal requirement, but apparently it's not!
quote:
As for why they do this? I don't really know, maybe they're worried you'll hurt your wrist by getting your arms tangled up together or something.
The reason for the "push-pull" steering method is not necessarily to prevent wrist pain. The main reason for the "push-pull" steering method is so your arms don't get tangled up when you are making regular turns or making a sudden/emergency manuever when driving the bus. |
Edited by - B. Busguy33 on 08/09/2006 10:49:12 AM |
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Thomas Ford 85-16
Top Member
USA
4177 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 2:23:02 PM
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Here in MI, we get marked down on our driver's test if we use the push-pull technique. Hand-over-hand is a must.  |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 2:45:24 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomas Ford 85-16
Here in MI, we get marked down on our driver's test if we use the push-pull technique. Hand-over-hand is a must.
I always thought it was just the fat old lady's that used the push-pull technique because they couldn't physically do hand over hand without straining themselves! I've always done hand over hand and I've never found myself tangled up. |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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JC Theriault
Top Member
Canada
1326 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 3:10:42 PM
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Hand over hand is how I was taught and tested on. Then you developed those bad habits in the old S-series Internationals with the 3 spoke wheels like resting your wrist on one of the spokes while travelling empty along a city street then all of a sudden bump the curb while the wrist is still in the wheel... ouch!
JC |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 4:04:51 PM
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I was trained for hand over hand, and that seems to be the general steering technique here in NY.
Personally, I find it easier to do hand over hand than to do the harlem shuffle. |
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busdrver4jesus
Top Member
USA
802 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 4:09:59 PM
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OK guys, a couple of you saw what I saw. I just thought it would make an interesting converation, and so far, it has. Like I said, its nothing bad on Blue Bird, or the video, but as I said, as a bus driver, you tend to notice things!
1. At the beginning of the video, when the students exited the bus,
they did not wait for the drivers signal, nor did they even check
traffic before crossing the street.
2. At the end, the students who were boarding from the door side of the
bus did not wait for the drivers signal to board or for the door to
open before starting toward the bus.
Both of these situations in REAL time would be concidered dangerous, and on my bus, a disciplinary infraction.
Anyway, just food for thought. As everyone said, its just a PROMO video, so nothing to get too upset over.
Hope I didn't upset or confuse anyone, 'cause Lord knows, a school bus driver has enough confusion at the beginning of the year as it is!
HAVE A GREAT SCHOOL YEAR EVERYONE! |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 5:50:06 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by bus724
quote:
Ummm...how does one skip the ambers?
There seems to be some confusion about the way warning lights operate, so let me see if I can clarify...
There are two modes on every electronic flasher: Sequential, and Non-Sequential.
In Sequential mode, the amber lights must flash before the reds during normal operation; open the door without the ambers on and the reds stay off. With the door open, press the amber switch, and the reds will start to flash. An optional red override will bypass this and turn the reds on immediately.
In Non-Sequential mode, the reds will activate any time the door is open (provided the master switch is on). Period. It doesn't matter if the ambers are turned on or not, open the door and the reds flash. An override switch may also be provided, but is only necessary with air/electric door.
Different state specs dictate which mode must be used on buses in that state.
Virginia is a sequential state then. I played with it today and the only way to skip the ambers is to hit the switch with the door alraedy open. The only only other traffic light controls we have are "override" or "master" which kill the traffics without closing the door. And the "interupt" switch which keeps the stop arm and crossing gate in while traffic lights are on.
It's definitely "hand over hand" steering here too. I don't understand that "push-pull" method....what about tight turns where you have to get those wheels cut QUICK. You'd have to slow down to an absolute crawl! |
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80-RE4
Top Member
USA
5700 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 10:11:30 PM
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ok, what on earth are you all talking about. I turn my wheel and the bus turns, that's all I care about. Push pull or hand over hand, I’m confused! look, turn, make sure it's safe, continue my turn, complete my Turn -.  It's worked for the past five years.
about the sequential/non sequential system: 96 Amtran re: you had to activate the yellows first until the flashers blew and they replaced them with a different set up, then the red lights would come on even without putting the ambers on.
On the 97 Amtran re, the reds would come on without activating the ambers
on the 2000 Amtran re, same as the 96-
on all of the Thomas buses, the red lights come on even if you don't activate your yellows
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Edited by - 80-RE4 on 08/09/2006 10:18:33 PM |
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bus724
Top Member
USA
1609 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2006 : 10:33:28 PM
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| AmTran, that's how it's supposed to be in MA (and CT), the non-sequential flash-reds-whenever-door-opens system. If you had a bus that required the ambers be turned on first, it either had a faulty flasher or was installed incorrectly. (It's very easy to change on the flashers used today, you simply have to plug the door switch into a different pin.) |
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busdrver4jesus
Top Member
USA
802 Posts |
Posted - 08/10/2006 : 06:17:55 AM
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The warning light system on SC buses are all set up the same:
Activate amber warning lights by pressing a momentary toggle switch located on the instrument panel. Amber lights flash outside, front and back as well as pilot light on the instrument panel.
Open the door, the amber lights cancel and the red lights, stop arm, and crossing arm activiate.
Close the door, and everything cancels with the exception to the 2001+ model buses where the red lights, stop arm, & crossing arm stay active until the child safety alarm (CSA) completes its cycle.
We have an over ride switch which will active the red lights, stop arm, and crossing arm. However, its to be used ONLY if the amber warning lights malfunction. Some drivers use the overide in cold weather to keep from having to open the door while waiting on students. Thats a no no, but some still do it. |
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Topic |
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Vision - Am I The Only One Who Noticed?
