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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
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krmvcs
Advanced Member
362 Posts |
 Posted - 09/13/2016 : 1:19:20 PM
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| maybe. but just for added deterrence, how about another arm from under the bus comes out with the stop sign that deploys a spike strip? |
-Ken- |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 05:03:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by krmvcs
maybe. but just for added deterrence, how about another arm from under the bus comes out with the stop sign that deploys a spike strip?
Now there's an idea. Lol... |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 05:14:59 AM
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| I wonder what the conversation was when the amber and red lights came out? I can imagine it was much like this one. I think people are in their own world and no amount of mechanical devices will do much good. I think the school bus community has made accidents by bus drivers lower by training. I would say the only way to make accidents by the common everyday driver is to require training. Just my two cents. |
Bryan |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 05:29:23 AM
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At least one school system in West Virginia is already doing this starting last year. The media hasn't followed up on it (that I know of).
I've got a handful of buses with auxiliary warning lights mounted just above the bumper, right in the motorists' line of sight. They seem to help a lot but at around $375 per kit it is cost-prohibitive to do many buses. http://www.akronbrass.com/supplemental-warning-light-kit
Bus driver and student training is the key. You just don't let kids off and let them run in front the the bus without a care in the world. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 05:47:48 AM
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Once people get over the surprise of the sign swinging way out there it will be back to "business as usual"..........
Even if motorists are paying attention, no cop, no stop, is pretty much the norm theses days no matter if the stop sign is on a bus or a post.
The fear of being a victim of road rage or getting rear ended has even the normally cautious driver checking his mirror to access the risk of stopping versus not.
Problem; Motorists won't stop at a stop sign/light intersection.
Solution; Put in a round about. |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 05:51:12 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Fastback
Problem; Motorists won't stop at a stop sign/light intersection.
Solution; Put in a round about.
Oh good God, shup up and don't give the road departments any more ideas!!!!!!!!!! They put a mess of those in around NW Columbus, but my favorite is the double roundabout with 2 schools on either side, a gas station, a church, a pizza joint and an oil change place and 11 crosswalks. OH...did I mention it's double laned and 84 passenger buses have to stop and wait for it to clear because they need both lanes to circle it? Great engineering! |
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Sherm
Top Member
USA
621 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 06:05:46 AM
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I don't even drive those in my car, TB24!
No mechanical device will make crossers safer, now that motorists AND crossing students are on phones and not paying attention. Training, practice, enforcement of student crossing procedures, and routing as many curbside stops as possible are the best solutions.
One benefit of a roundabout, though...you can stop on one side of the street, turn around without backing up, and service the other side of the street without crossing students. |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 06:27:50 AM
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| @bwest nailed it. To reduce incidents like in the video, there needs to be training for the driver and students. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 06:47:40 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
quote:
Originally posted by Fastback
Problem; Motorists won't stop at a stop sign/light intersection.
Solution; Put in a round about.
Oh good God, shup up and don't give the road departments any more ideas!!!!!!!!!! They put a mess of those in around NW Columbus, but my favorite is the double roundabout with 2 schools on either side, a gas station, a church, a pizza joint and an oil change place and 11 crosswalks. OH...did I mention it's double laned and 84 passenger buses have to stop and wait for it to clear because they need both lanes to circle it? Great engineering!
Don't get me wrong, I don't advocate round abouts, that just seems to be the solution of choice from the powers that be. |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 06:51:23 AM
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| Fastback...just a little good natured ribbing...not intended to be serious! Sorry for the misunderstanding. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 07:52:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
Fastback...just a little good natured ribbing...not intended to be serious! Sorry for the misunderstanding.
I figured you were 
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Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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baptistbusman1
Senior Member
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2016 : 3:46:12 PM
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| A lot of times when our drivers come in with stop sign violations, they have the license number, make of car, description of the driver, hair color, age, color of clothes, music he was listening to and everything else an observant person notices. My question is usually, "how were you watching the kids and getting all this info?" Stop signs mean nothing if the driver doesn't take control of telling the kids when to cross. |
I was formally Baptistbusman. However, I lost my password, and had not updated my email address.
Here is a link to my old posts. http://www.schoolbusfleet.com/forum/search.asp?mode=DoIt&MEMBER_ID=1846 |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2016 : 05:37:18 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by baptistbusman1
A lot of times when our drivers come in with stop sign violations, they have the license number, make of car, description of the driver, hair color, age, color of clothes, music he was listening to and everything else an observant person notices. My question is usually, "how were you watching the kids and getting all this info?" Stop signs mean nothing if the driver doesn't take control of telling the kids when to cross.
lol, Don't fuss at them that much. Our police need nearly all that to follow up on it. We live in a very small town/ area and the driver can often tell me who the driver was but not the plate number. No matter... the police want all the other including the plate number. In my opinion this is getting worse in Illinois because they upped the penalty. You may wonder why I think this, let me explain. You see before, the first offense was a fine and maybe a probation of some sort and points on your license. Now, the driver loses his/ her license for 30 days. Well, policemen are human and have human emotion. So, when a driver says they will lose their job if they can't drive for a month then they just give them a verbal warning. I think this actually lessens the penalty by practice. I suspect the law will change again at some point but I do live in the People's Republic of Illinois so who knows. |
Bryan |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2016 : 06:32:14 AM
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Long stop arm $1250......Saves a kids life PRICELESS! https://bussafetysolutions.com/shop/
Every time a car runs into it cost $55 (plastic break away bolts). Just FYI.
Any takers? I'm going to call the company and see if they can loan one to try out. Can't hurt.
Edit: Break away bolts come in package of 100 ea. for $55. |
Edited by - JoeHEB1 on 09/16/2016 08:01:58 AM |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2016 : 07:52:20 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by JoeHEB1
Long stop arm $1250......Saves a kids life PRICELESS! https://bussafetysolutions.com/shop/
Every time a car runs into it cost $55 (plastic break away bolts). Just FYI.
Any takers? I'm going to call the company and see if they can loan one to try out. Can't hurt.
It has be be approved in your state too. |
Bryan |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2016 : 07:55:20 AM
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| It should be, I'm not too far from McKinney ISD (Texas) shown in the video. Good point though. |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2016 : 09:02:57 AM
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| Ah! |
Bryan |
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Winn10
Active Member
49 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2016 : 5:30:25 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by JoeHEB1
Long stop arm $1250......Saves a kids life PRICELESS! https://bussafetysolutions.com/shop/
Every time a car runs into it cost $55 (plastic break away bolts). Just FYI.
Any takers? I'm going to call the company and see if they can loan one to try out. Can't hurt.
Edit: Break away bolts come in package of 100 ea. for $55.
i am not bashing the company, its a great idea. but we ran 5 units beginning last school year, and until they can "refine" the design and execution of the design i wouldnt buy the product at this time. the company revised ours twice and cost us out of pocket each time. the plastic bolts break often with no collision, and as far as collisions go, the plastic bolts are NOT the only thing that snap. the stop sign return "system" isnt reliable. they are no longer on our buses, 7 months was long enough. again i am not bashing the company, i welcome the progressive thinking, just giving an honest review of the product that we piloted. hope this helps. |
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KnuckleBuster76
Active Member
45 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 04:01:08 AM
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| I don't believe anything will keep people from running the arm. People who are bad enough to run ANY arm aren't going to be deterred by anything, in my opinion. You see a school bus and you know there's going to be a stop arm coming out, but to some people, they don't have time to follow the laws or be safe. Remember: They OWN the road and the world revolves around them. How DARE we put a stop arm out and get in their way? Shame. On. Us. |
"Just... I dunno... Just fix it." |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 04:20:42 AM
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@Winn10 thanks for the honest review. It looks like they need more refining to do on the stop arm. It's like the first model of a new car, don't buy it until they work out all the bugs buy the second year model.
@KuckleBuster76 you are absolutely right HOW DARE WE! LOL.. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 05:00:34 AM
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| Big thanks to Winn10 for the info! |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 05:29:54 AM
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| I'm not excusing people for running stop arms here. I think most people are in their own world and either don't see the bus (doesn't register in their mind) or they don't have a grasp of the seriousness of the action. I think if most people were able to look at this from our perspective, they would be looking for buses every time they drive. I know if I travel I am looking for them and even find myself looking for them on Saturday, lol. However, I have seen a video lately where there were at least 4 cars that drove through the stop sign of a bus. They acted like they saw the sign and then proceeded with caution because they didn't see a child. It was amazing to watch. Thankfully, I don't have that big of a problem with it in our district. |
Bryan |
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KnuckleBuster76
Active Member
45 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 07:38:06 AM
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| bwest, that's EXACTLY the problem. "Oh, I don't see a kid, so it must be okay to go past the bus." Makes me sick. It's that kind of thought process (or lack of thought process) that can end in tragedy. I think maybe a camera on the stop arm that can be "clicked" by the driver, so the make, model, and plate of the offender can be properly seen would be a huge asset. I also think that local law enforcement needs to see how serious a problem this is! |
"Just... I dunno... Just fix it." |
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torque
Advanced Member
Canada
358 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 08:41:04 AM
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Locally they have tried STOP arm cameras with great success. A few laws over the years make it so you dont have to identify the driver, the owner of the vehicle is fined, making it up to the driver be responsible for who they let use their vehicle.
http://www.orleansonline.ca/pages/N2016083102.htm |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 08:57:53 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by torque
Locally they have tried STOP arm cameras with great success. A few laws over the years make it so you dont have to identify the driver, the owner of the vehicle is fined, making it up to the driver be responsible for who they let use their vehicle.
http://www.orleansonline.ca/pages/N2016083102.htm
A few districts here have stop sign cameras and have a hard time collecting fines. They collect less 20% from offenders, so 2 out of 10 offenders pay up and the other 8 you can forget about it. It's a whole legal issue thing since a cop didn't see them do it. I believe a police officer has to issue the citation to legally hold them accountable. I think the district would have to hire a police officer to view the video to then issue the citation. I may be wrong though.
Edit: going by state law (Texas) that is. |
Edited by - JoeHEB1 on 09/19/2016 09:00:05 AM |
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torque
Advanced Member
Canada
358 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 1:08:06 PM
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Opps, my edit, it is up to the OWNER of the vehicle to be responsible for who drives their vehicle.
A few years back it was like that here, but for the stop arm camera, red light runner cameras, the fine and demerit points go to the owner of the vehicle.
You need people in government that step up and change the laws to address the problem as they change.
Another problem here, and I am sure it is there also, distracted driving, texting, cell phone etc while driving. There is push here to make it the same penalties as impaired driving, also likely the cause sometimes for red light runners and stop arm runners. |
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Winn10
Active Member
49 Posts |
Posted - 09/19/2016 : 2:01:23 PM
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| i agree with torque. We piloted some stop sign cameras and had a lot of pictures of plate numbers, but our county would not prosecute because there was no proof that the owner was driving. the word now is that has since changed and the owner is mailed a fine, regardless who was driving, and part of the fine supposedly is distributed to our local schools. now we are waiting for the new stop sign cameras to be installed. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2016 : 04:43:10 AM
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| I just heard back from the the state patrol this morning. Ohio will not be allowing the signs. While they seems to like the idea of it, they have concerns about liability of encroaching into the opposing traffic lane as well as kids getting hurt by the sign itself if knocked off by a drive-by. |
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1983WardFord
Top Member
USA
1395 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2016 : 05:31:46 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
I just heard back from the the state patrol this morning. Ohio will not be allowing the signs. While they seems to like the idea of it, they have concerns about liability of encroaching into the opposing traffic lane as well as kids getting hurt by the sign itself if knocked off by a drive-by.
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Due to the current economic condition, the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned off until further notice. |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2016 : 06:05:11 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
I just heard back from the the state patrol this morning. Ohio will not be allowing the signs. While they seems to like the idea of it, they have concerns about liability of encroaching into the opposing traffic lane as well as kids getting hurt by the sign itself if knocked off by a drive-by.
Wow... I think the kid would get hurt by getting run over not by the sign being knocked off. But I can see it being a hazard in certain streets though. |
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torque
Advanced Member
Canada
358 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2016 : 11:46:01 AM
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Oh ya, the long arm.
Personally here are my thoughts, brings a whole new urgency to the radio call "my stop arm wont come in", "my crossing arm keeps coming out while I'm driving". |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 09/20/2016 : 1:33:59 PM
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| They didn't put 100 plus wind turbines up in my area for nothing, it would take solid construction and some power to get one of those long arms out and retracted. |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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Topic |
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Longer stop arm. Will it work?
