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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
 Posted - 05/13/2016 : 04:18:21 AM
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| I have a VT365 that smokes at take off, it smokes like a chimney (black smoke). I've replaced all sensors on the intake manifold and replaced all injectors. I have a turbo on order, its blowing so much oil that the hoses on the CAC are seaping oil. It's been smoking for a while I sure hope replacing the turbo fixes the smoking issue. What have you guys done to address this issue? I have other VT365 that smoke as well but not as bad as this one. |
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Bus Tech II
Senior Member
121 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 04:44:40 AM
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| 2 common ways oil is entered into the CAC system. Turbo and crankcase breather element. |
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Bus Tech II
Senior Member
121 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 04:46:48 AM
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| Also found after time the oil/fuel deposits that are in the catalyst muffler smolder and actually have embers inside from burning the oil/fuel |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 04:53:29 AM
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In my fuzzy memory I seem to remember our 6.0 Powerstroke smoking a lot once and the culprit was a bad EGR valve. I believe I was told at the time that the VT365s weren't as prone to this problem because International used an EGR valve with a more powerful opening/closing mechanism.
Of course our Powerstroke smoked even more the time its turbo shaft failed  |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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dsalinas1939
Top Member
USA
1323 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 05:00:24 AM
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| i had one a few months ago it was blow by oil was pouring out the pcv hose into the cac ended up two of the cylinders where washed out good thing it was a jasper engine covered under warrenty |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 06:37:50 AM
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| I'll be trying the EGR valve and the crankcase breather before replacing the turbo. Thanks guys I'll keep y'all posted. |
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drp53188
Senior Member
89 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 10:17:11 AM
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All of my VT365s no longer vent the crankcase into the air intake they now have road draft tubes.
If it is blowing that much oil the cylinders are out of round and your looking at a reman. if you get too much oil in the CAC it will runaway on you! |
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krmvcs
Advanced Member
362 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 10:35:15 AM
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| i say let it run away. if youre lucky it wont ever come back. |
-Ken- |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 11:30:18 AM
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@drp53188 is there a kit to install draft tubes? And is it legal?
@krmvcs with my luck it would find its way back LOL!!! If I didn't have bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all. |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2016 : 12:15:02 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by JoeHEB1
@drp53188 is there a kit to install draft tubes? And is it legal?
@krmvcs with my luck it would find its way back LOL!!! If I didn't have bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all.
Wouldn't that be nice. I have 8 of them with new remans installed in the last 12 months. |
US Army retired CMBT |
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Winn10
Active Member
49 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2016 : 07:31:34 AM
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| another thing to look at is the air compressor if equipped. we've had a couple that the air compressors fixed. we have a couple that ooze oil from every gasket, oring, and mating surface on the engine. we tried to re ring one and it didn't help at all. just waiting for a major failure to replace engines. unfortunately we have a minimum of 10 years before they will be replaced, unless we can magically get them to 250k miles before 2026. |
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wrenchsnapper
Active Member
27 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2016 : 11:22:12 AM
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| If you have black smoke I would check that the DOC isnt plugged. You would also have very high backpressure under load. Most all vt365 at 100,000 that Ive worked on have plugged the doc and just have a walnut sized hole left for exhaust to get through. I saw a fist sized hole in the front end and pressure wash them out then weld the plate back on. If your getting lots of oil seeping through the turbo joints and cac hoses make sure you dont have a high pressure oil leak foaming up the oil and blowing it out the breather. |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 04:14:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by wrenchsnapper
If you have black smoke I would check that the DOC isnt plugged. You would also have very high backpressure under load. Most all vt365 at 100,000 that Ive worked on have plugged the doc and just have a walnut sized hole left for exhaust to get through. I saw a fist sized hole in the front end and pressure wash them out then weld the plate back on. If your getting lots of oil seeping through the turbo joints and cac hoses make sure you dont have a high pressure oil leak foaming up the oil and blowing it out the breather.
Our 2008 VT365 has a catalyst muffler, not sure if its the same as a DOC. I could be wrong though. I replaced the crankcase breather for now. We'll see how that goes. I'll report back my findings. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 04:31:15 AM
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DOC = diesel oxidation catalyst = catalyst muffler  |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
Edited by - Fastback on 05/16/2016 04:32:25 AM |
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drp53188
Senior Member
89 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 10:10:58 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RonF
quote:
Originally posted by JoeHEB1
@drp53188 is there a kit to install draft tubes? And is it legal?
@krmvcs with my luck it would find its way back LOL!!! If I didn't have bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all.
Wouldn't that be nice. I have 8 of them with new remans installed in the last 12 months.
Nope just made them, you will have to check with your local laws. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 11:15:18 AM
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| The local International dealer here recently converted one of our MaxxForce 7s to a road draft tube. |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/16/2016 : 1:48:19 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Fastback
The local International dealer here recently converted one of our MaxxForce 7s to a road draft tube.
I'll check with our dealer to see if its legal and if they have a kit.
Edit: no go, spoke with the dealer and they said there is no such kit for a road draft tube for a VT365. Shux... |
Edited by - JoeHEB1 on 05/16/2016 1:55:48 PM |
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tlbc
New Member
9 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 05:23:17 AM
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| I have had some issues with the 365 also and was wondering what kind of mileage you are getting before you have to do a engine replacement. I am about that 150,000 mile range. |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 05:32:31 AM
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We just completed our last replacement and all have been between 100,000 and 150,000 miles. I do believe some of this was self inflicted. Before I got here the oil changes were done once a year during the summer and maybe during Christmas break. Our buses drive 20,000-30,000 miles a year.
We now change oil on the VT365's every 5,000 miles. |
US Army retired CMBT |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 09:02:13 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RonF
We just completed our last replacement and all have been between 100,000 and 150,000 miles. I do believe some of this was self inflicted. Before I got here the oil changes were done once a year during the summer and maybe during Christmas break. Our buses drive 20,000-30,000 miles a year.
We now change oil on the VT365's every 5,000 miles.
This one is coming up on 100k, so you're saying it needs to be replaced soon? These things should last well over 100k. We change oil every 6 months on ours. |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 09:29:30 AM
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| They should last longer than that. You really should change you oil by mileage, hours or gallons of fuel use instead of time. Unless you have really low mileage. |
US Army retired CMBT |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2016 : 11:03:22 AM
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Update: replacing the crankcase breather didn't do a thing, still smokes. So I'm blaming the turbo for the oil seeping from the CAC hoses and possibly causing it to smoke.
@RonF our buses run about 12k miles per year, which is why we go with every 6 months. Some may go a little further but they all average around 12-14k. |
Edited by - JoeHEB1 on 05/17/2016 11:05:16 AM |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 10/24/2016 : 09:50:00 AM
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Finally figured out why this little gem was smoking. Take a look for yourself. Most rocker arm pivots were worn or gone, push rods were all worn and bent (rolled them on a piece of glass). Valve bridges were worn from the pivots being worn. You can see a rocker arm broke which prompted us to pull the valve covers off and see all this wear.
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2016 : 03:52:44 AM
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| WOW. By looking at the pictures and your description, it looks and sounds as if you have an engine lub problem. Either low oil pressure or plugged passages. You may want to change your oil more often. |
US Army retired CMBT |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2016 : 04:22:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by RonF
WOW. By looking at the pictures and your description, it looks and sounds as if you have an engine lub problem. Either low oil pressure or plugged passages. You may want to change your oil more often.
So far this is the only one with this much wear on it. You're right though, I'll have to change the interval if it happens again. |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2016 : 04:44:23 AM
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| There was a TSI letter from International some years back suggesting the OCI for the VT365's be changed to 5000 miles. I've searched IC's site and cannot find it. Our IC reps tell us the same thing, 5000 miles. |
US Army retired CMBT |
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bluebirdvision
Top Member
USA
1081 Posts |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2016 : 10:28:30 AM
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I'm running 10,000 my C7's as per the engine manual. You really can't compare the 2. The VT 365's have a lot of fuel dilution issues plus they run a lot of EGR in that motor thus getting thinned out and dirty oil. Mostly dirty from all of the EGR.
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US Army retired CMBT |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 10/25/2016 : 12:18:23 PM
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| 10,000 interval here too (Cat's), no problems other than the typical cylinder 5 distortion/ring failures. Oil sampled one recently, pretty darn good even at nearly 10K on the oil. |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2016 : 07:50:43 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
10,000 interval here too (Cat's), no problems other than the typical cylinder 5 distortion/ring failures. Oil sampled one recently, pretty darn good even at nearly 10K on the oil.
LOL, the guy that overhauls my cats tells me I've got a lube problem when we find broken rings and some bearing wear. He and I argue this every time I bring one in. He says, when are you going to change oils? I say, never, because that isn't the problem! lol Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. |
Bryan |
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What have you guys done about this?
