Author |
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RBrian
Senior Member
United States
71 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2016 : 05:18:53 AM
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quote: Originally posted by Fastback
quote: Originally posted by RBrian
We buy 300 gallon totes for $564. Thats $1.88 a gallon. We used 2,800 gallons last year.
I thought the totes were 330 gallons.
They are 330 gallon totes with 300 gallons of DEF in them. Room for expansion. |
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BigPapa
Advanced Member
215 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2016 : 06:53:02 AM
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We buy in bulk, $1.54/Gallon. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2016 : 08:47:14 AM
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quote: Originally posted by bwest
This was filmed a couple months ago. I thought FS did a good job of editing. Hope you enjoy it.
Shill.
Very nice video & info! |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2016 : 2:19:31 PM
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quote: Originally posted by Thomasbus24
quote: Originally posted by bwest
This was filmed a couple months ago. I thought FS did a good job of editing. Hope you enjoy it.
Shill.
Very nice video & info!
What? You know I'm not a Shill! |
Bryan |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 01/08/2016 : 09:14:31 AM
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If I'm picking on you, I'm leaving somebody else alone.
A nearby school is expecting the state's first IC propane bus any day now (if not already there). Looking forward to seeing under the hood on that one. |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/08/2016 : 10:11:41 AM
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Yeah, I would like to see one too. They were a cool 10k more on their bid than the BB we bought in November. I am interested in them because they are a low speed engine. I have a tough time figuring out how they can get the HP and torque they need with an engine that runs in the same RPM range as a diesel. |
Bryan |
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steveolboy
New Member
8 Posts |
Posted - 01/08/2016 : 11:23:26 AM
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The totes are not all the same size/capacity. Just one more variable to crunch numbers against. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
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second.flood
Top Member
USA
640 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 05:52:15 AM
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Larger displacement, bigger bore and longer stroke, cam profiles, and higher compression ratio are ways to increase torque.
I'd much rather have a large displacement, low rpm engine for severe service such as a school bus application. |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 06:16:42 AM
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IC can't get medium duty diesel engines right, how can they be any better in propane? |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 08:58:59 AM
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quote: Originally posted by JoeHEB1
IC can't get medium duty diesel engines right, how can they be any better in propane?
LOL, not that I want to come to IC's defence here but prior to the EPA mandated engines International did a super job of building engines. Propane engines are simple enough that I believe the same tried and true methods will work with them. The other factor is that an outside company is the one that is really building the thing anyway.
I'm really interested in seeing this thing. I too believe that a slower RPM engine will be a plus. Not that I'm having trouble with my current units, it's just unnerving to listen to them rap out as tight as they do. lol |
Bryan |
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JRob
Advanced Member
207 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 09:00:19 AM
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quote: severe service such as a school bus application
Thread hijack but this works into this discussion. What makes the school bus application severe? What characteristics of the school bus duty cycle contribute to this perception? |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 09:32:38 AM
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Mostly stop and go. If you read any owner's manual the "severe duty" service intervals are explained. I have it in my mind that the main thing is the spool up and down of the engine all the time. A school bus is a lot like a garbage truck in that aspect. To steer us back to the topic (not that it matters, lol), this is the reason I think a propane engine will last as long or longer in our application. A diesel was never intended to be used in an application like ours. It was intended to be used on gen sets, ships, tractors, over the road trucks, etc. Of course, these are all my opinions. I'm sure there are others here that can, and probably will, disagree with me.
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Bryan |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 09:34:42 AM
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quote: Originally posted by bwest
LOL, not that I want to come to IC's defence here but prior to the EPA mandated engines International did a super job of building engines. Propane engines are simple enough that I believe the same tried and true methods will work with them. The other factor is that an outside company is the one that is really building the thing anyway.
I'm really interested in seeing this thing. I too believe that a slower RPM engine will be a plus. Not that I'm having trouble with my current units, it's just unnerving to listen to them rap out as tight as they do. lol
You hit the nail on the head Bryan, EPA! |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/12/2016 : 09:39:25 AM
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quote: Originally posted by JoeHEB1
quote: Originally posted by bwest
LOL, not that I want to come to IC's defence here but prior to the EPA mandated engines International did a super job of building engines. Propane engines are simple enough that I believe the same tried and true methods will work with them. The other factor is that an outside company is the one that is really building the thing anyway.
I'm really interested in seeing this thing. I too believe that a slower RPM engine will be a plus. Not that I'm having trouble with my current units, it's just unnerving to listen to them rap out as tight as they do. lol
You hit the nail on the head Bryan, EPA!
Thus the reason for my fascination with propane. There are no add ons on the engine to make it clean. It's just an engine! |
Bryan |
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RBrian
Senior Member
United States
71 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 04:29:18 AM
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FYI-In case you didn't know. IHC doesn't manufacture the engine. Power Solutions International does. |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 05:49:20 AM
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quote: Originally posted by RBrian
FYI-In case you didn't know. IHC doesn't manufacture the engine. Power Solutions International does.
That my be but International probably designs it. |
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flint1
Senior Member
Canada
74 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 06:06:45 AM
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The PSI propane engine is based off the GM 8.1L big block engine, bored and stroked. Just spoke with my IC rep, they have ordered a gasoline powered CE with the GM 8.1L. I'll be taking that for a demo. |
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 08:01:57 AM
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Both the Thomas and IC propane engines definitely look like big block Chevy truck engines. I have driven the Thomas..... |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
Edited by - Fastback on 01/13/2016 08:04:07 AM |
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JoeHEB1
Advanced Member
498 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 08:54:40 AM
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We have 9 birds and use 4 drums a year at $150 per drum. |
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flint1
Senior Member
Canada
74 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 09:03:03 AM
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How did the Thomas drive?
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Fastback
Top Member
1500 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 09:57:04 AM
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quote: Originally posted by flint1
How did the Thomas drive?
Very good pickup from a standing start. Sound reminded me of driving a big block V8 to cruise night. I remember thinking in a short wheelbase bus this would be a blast to drive. Also wondered how I or any driver would leave the stop signs after the novelty wore off or with kids on board. I did note that Thomas eliminated the expected engine air intake from the side of the hood and routed it under the hood forward to near the radiator, I assume for sound control. If the IC offering truly makes 165 ft lbs more torque at 1,000 rpm..........I just gotta test drive one. |
Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback |
Edited by - Fastback on 01/13/2016 09:58:39 AM |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 01/13/2016 : 12:09:04 PM
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quote: Originally posted by Fastback
quote: Originally posted by flint1
How did the Thomas drive?
If the IC offering truly makes 165 ft lbs more torque at 1,000 rpm..........I just gotta test drive one.
I agree!! I really want to see (or drive) the proof! |
Bryan |
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Carp_26
Administrator
United States
170 Posts |
Posted - 05/22/2016 : 6:26:03 PM
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quote: Originally posted by Thomasbus24
If I'm picking on you, I'm leaving somebody else alone.
A nearby school is expecting the state's first IC propane bus any day now (if not already there). Looking forward to seeing under the hood on that one.
Thomasbus24...Do you know if the first Ohio IC Propane unit was delivered? Has the unit been inspected and placed into route service? Sorry to bump this topic but I've been curious about this since I read it in your original post. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2016 : 06:51:42 AM
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Not just yet. It went down the line just a few buses ahead of my two new ones and I believe they just arrived in the state Friday, so they won't see the road til August.
The back story is that there were some reliability issues on the test units, so IC didn't want to ship those issues out into the real world. |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05/23/2016 : 12:06:58 PM
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I have been told that a district (not sure where) refused shipment of IC propane buses because of issue. I sure hope they get the issues worked out. Competition is an awesome thing! |
Bryan |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 05/24/2016 : 07:28:30 AM
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Something to do with getting the fuel from the tank, 30 feet forward at the right pressure and volume. Supposed to be resolved now. |
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eshover
Senior Member
146 Posts |
Posted - 05/24/2016 : 09:26:40 AM
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Has anyone that has a BB propane V-10 had exhaust manifold studs break or the nuts work loose? We had some break off and were replaced with stainless steel. Now some of the nuts are working loose. ED |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05/24/2016 : 09:38:27 AM
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quote: Originally posted by eshover
Has anyone that has a BB propane V-10 had exhaust manifold studs break or the nuts work loose? We had some break off and were replaced with stainless steel. Now some of the nuts are working loose. ED
Humm, no haven't had that happen. Only thing I've had problems with to do with the fuel or engine is the 80% fill valve failed, and we had a wire get skinned and short to ground (going to the low coolant level sensor of all things) and make fuel pressure go to zero momentarily. |
Bryan |
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exmod110
Senior Member
150 Posts |
Posted - 05/24/2016 : 1:48:51 PM
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Get used to fixing those mfld nuts-studs, it's a Ford engine and they never did "fix" that concern! |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05/24/2016 : 2:40:12 PM
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quote: Originally posted by exmod110
Get used to fixing those mfld nuts-studs, it's a Ford engine and they never did "fix" that concern!
What mileage/ age does it happen? I have one with 60k on it and 2 years old that hasn't had a problem. |
Bryan |
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exmod110
Senior Member
150 Posts |
Posted - 05/25/2016 : 09:23:51 AM
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Was never a mileage kinda thing. When I worked in the Ford dealership up here, we did LOTS and LOTS of manifolds and studs. It is the same motor as the 5.4 and 4.6 just with 2 extra cyls. for us it was almost always the right side mfld-studs we worked on... Seamed to be due to the lack of inner fender protecting that area from wheel splash causing rapid changes in temps. I know of one BB on pane further north and he has done studs a couple times in the 2 years he has had the bus, no other complaints though. I did show him this product to help in the future.... http://maniboltdriller.com/ personally never used it but the tec's that have say its great. |
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bwest
Administrator
United States
3820 Posts |
Posted - 05/25/2016 : 09:44:44 AM
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quote: Originally posted by exmod110
Was never a mileage kinda thing. When I worked in the Ford dealership up here, we did LOTS and LOTS of manifolds and studs. It is the same motor as the 5.4 and 4.6 just with 2 extra cyls. for us it was almost always the right side mfld-studs we worked on... Seamed to be due to the lack of inner fender protecting that area from wheel splash causing rapid changes in temps. I know of one BB on pane further north and he has done studs a couple times in the 2 years he has had the bus, no other complaints though. I did show him this product to help in the future.... http://maniboltdriller.com/ personally never used it but the tec's that have say its great.
Nice!! Thanks for the link! Hope I never have to deal with it but if I do, this will be the ticket! |
Bryan |
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jeeptjken
Senior Member
147 Posts |
Posted - 05/25/2016 : 1:45:12 PM
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we have 2 BB propane in our fleet both got studs under warranty the dealer had a jig that attached to the manifold and a guide for the drill to drill them out better them then me hahahahah but the propane do run nice and make heat in the winter time for sure |
How did you get the gosinta in the whatchamacallit |
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