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partsman_ba
Administrator
United States
377 Posts |
 Posted - 03/25/2015 : 11:43:41 AM
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| We just got a 2500PTS replaced under the BB Partner Program extended warranty, and the service advisor at our Allison dealer told us he could have denied the claim due to our using NAPA filters (Wix spin-on, Balkamp suction) but he "did us a favor" and took care of it. The warranty info he ran off for us from Allison's system, and the warranty pamphlet we got with the bus, both state "Partner Program Coverage requires the continued use of Allison TES 295 transmission fluid and Genuine Allison Filters." Isn't this illegal under Magnuson-Moss as long as you use OE equivalent or better parts, even on an extended warranty? Anyone ever have to battle with their Allison dealer over this? |
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RonF
Top Member
867 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2015 : 12:46:54 PM
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| That's the way I understand the Magnuson-Moss agreement to be |
US Army retired CMBT |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4545 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2015 : 6:36:54 PM
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From the act:
(c) Prohibition on conditions for written or implied warranty; waiver by Commission
No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumer’s using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade, or corporate name; except that the prohibition of this subsection may be waived by the Commission if—
(1) the warrantor satisfies the Commission that the warranted product will function properly only if the article or service so identified is used in connection with the warranted product, and
(2) the Commission finds that such a waiver is in the public interest. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4545 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2015 : 6:39:07 PM
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Translation...unless Allison can prove that no other filter will work (which experience shows us is not the case)...they have no leg to stand on.
I'd ask them if a $3000 warranty claim is REALLY worth tens of thousands of dollars in litigation to them. |
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dwight
Senior Member
USA
58 Posts |
Posted - 03/26/2015 : 01:45:40 AM
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As a Allison user from 1965 thru 1998 I can say that Allison did us an injustice when they started to introduce the new series of transmissions in 1971. (Original trouble free 6-speed with locking convertor & input/shaft retarder rated up to 80,000# GVW built in 1955-1973, 13 School Buses X 150,000 miles = 2,000,000 miles without removing even a single bolt from an oil pan.)
With the new series, Allison denied and tried to hide every design & production problem but always seemed to suggest every problem was caused by the end user. Rather than financially helping to improve their substandard product, they suggested ways to add external hosing & filters, restriction indicator lights, change to the newer classifications of oils several times that were only available thru Allison, and refused to retool for some outdated manual controlled transmissions for electronic controlled engine applications.
If Allison is willing to stand behind their product for a minimum of 100,000 miles of rural stop & go & highway operation, I would only use replacement filters and oils Approved For Use and Change Intervals By Allison. If early failure occurs, save the oil sample and demand full warranty. Sharon Dean of Allison is well aware of quality problems.
Dwight |
20 SCHOOL BUS FLEET OWNER/OPERATOR (Retired) |
Edited by - dwight on 03/27/2015 01:35:45 AM |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4545 Posts |
Posted - 03/26/2015 : 04:40:12 AM
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| Keep in mind that Eaton is entering our market...competition is a good thing. |
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partsman_ba
Administrator
United States
377 Posts |
Posted - 03/30/2015 : 3:17:07 PM
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| If they try and deny a claim over this, then I'd raise Cain, but since they replaced the transmission under warranty I'll let it slide. I just couldn't believe that they print it in their little pamphlet! |
"Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional." |
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JRob
Advanced Member
207 Posts |
Posted - 04/01/2015 : 1:42:22 PM
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quote:
"Partner Program Coverage requires the continued use of Allison TES 295 transmission fluid and Genuine Allison Filters."
I would say he is shooting from the lip on that statement. However, there is a kernel of truth and Magnusson-Moss isn't license to use what you want without making certain you have your ducks in a row.
TES 295 is a fluid spec so a fluid that complies with the spec and is certified as OK by Allison is OK for warranty. I would expect that the same holds true for the filter requirement. They likely have a filter medium requirement and a performance requirement that must be met to ensure warranty coverage. If you use other than Allison, the burden of establishing "equal or better" falls on you if there is an issue. So I would say he couldn't deny warranty provided you can show what you were using complies with the performance requirements of the filter in question. You just have to be sure you've done your homework. |
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second.flood
Top Member
USA
640 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 08:39:08 AM
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I use Shell Spirax S6 ATF A295 Transmission Oil which is TES-295 approved.
I use Allison filter 295399579, cost is only 8.99 each. I don't use the aftermarket filters, at one time there was an issue with the magnet covering too much of the holes causing a restriction.
No worries. |
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mysterytrain
Active Member
34 Posts |
Posted - 04/02/2015 : 08:44:08 AM
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| I also use one of the fluids on the allison list and their filters which are cheaper than the aftermarket, had major problems with aftermarkets blowing the gasket out, which by the way allison will not cover that type of damage |
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Bus Tech1
Senior Member
76 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2015 : 05:01:42 AM
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| We use Hydrotex fluid and haven`t lost a transmission since we switched 6 years ago. We always use Allison filters because of the magnet problem also. |
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Allison extended warranty and Magnuson-Moss
