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ricky g
Active Member

31 Posts

Posted - 03/13/2013 :  3:30:52 PM  Show Profile  Visit ricky g's Homepage  Reply with Quote
T444E OIL PAN NIGHTMARE , have had it off and back on 3 times , each time perfectly clean and dry , tried 3 different silicone types , no gasket available , any hints , tricks , secrets , advice would be greatly appreciated , seems to always leak at or near rear corners , Thanks .

1983ChevroletWayne
Senior Member

Canada
165 Posts

Posted - 03/13/2013 :  5:22:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ricky g

T444E OIL PAN NIGHTMARE , have had it off and back on 3 times , each time perfectly clean and dry , tried 3 different silicone types , no gasket available , any hints , tricks , secrets , advice would be greatly appreciated , seems to always leak at or near rear corners , Thanks .



The boys at our shop drop the pan, then they spray all the mating surface down with brake cleaner, wipe it down, and let it drip for a full day. Then they wipe it again the next day and let it sit for a few hours again. The oil dribbles for quite some time.

The next thing they do is use the red or blue RTV sealant. And put a bead all around the block then a bead all around the pan separately.

Let it cure for a few minutes then put it all together you should have a good bond. Let it sit for a full day to cure before adding fresh oil.

Our mechanic told me you have to take time, and you also have to make sure everything is very dry. Any trace amounts of oil will ruin a good seal. This is why they let it sit for a day with the pan off.

FYI: Our guys remove the front bumper and jack the engine up a bit to clear the front axle. They wedge square steel tubing under the block to raise it for the job. The guys tell me it makes the job of removing the pan underneath easier.

Hope it helps!


Formerly "83ChevroletWayne"



Pic courtesy of: "schoolbusdriver.org"
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willism
Senior Member

United States
138 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  04:35:30 AM  Show Profile  Visit willism's Homepage  Reply with Quote
We do about the same as above poster but we use right stuff sealer and put 4 dowl pins in so you stick it up and dont move it. Havent had any luck with the sealer international sells for the job.
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tigger2
Advanced Member

USA
282 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  06:12:27 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The trick for the T444 oil pan is to clean well as chevy wayne said use black high temp silicone but to let it set overnight to cure BEFORE putting the oil back in. The gray stuff nav. send in the kit is useless.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2296 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  08:11:07 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Take a look at the directions that come with silicone sealer. It will tell you how long to let it "cure" before installing. It's sometimes hard to be patient isn't it?

Bryan
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Fastback
Top Member

972 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  08:27:53 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Also make sure pan did not get distorted during the removal process. Specified removal tool cuts the sealant along the pan sides so less pry bar force action is needed.

Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback
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1983ChevroletWayne
Senior Member

Canada
165 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  08:30:13 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
UPDATE: Our shop has just recently starting using what "willism" was talking about I believe. "The right stuff" gasket sealer by permetex. It sets in a few minutes. They have switched to this instead of the RTV I had mentioned above. They put the bolts on finger tight and let this set for the day with no oil.


Formerly "83ChevroletWayne"



Pic courtesy of: "schoolbusdriver.org"

Edited by - 1983ChevroletWayne on 03/14/2013 08:39:11 AM
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Fastback
Top Member

972 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  09:05:36 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Also make sure no sealant gets in the bolt thread holes as it can cause the bolts to "bottom out" in the holes.

Why yes, the ORIGinal CHARGER is a Fastback
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2296 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  09:11:32 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Fastback

Also make sure no sealant gets in the bolt thread holes as it can cause the bolts to "bottom out" in the holes.



Never thought of that. Learn something everyday.

Bryan
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ricky g
Active Member

31 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2013 :  12:40:31 PM  Show Profile  Visit ricky g's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks for all the hints and advice guys , I will try again and let you know how I make out .
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Tb4020
Senior Member

United States
65 Posts

Posted - 03/15/2013 :  04:09:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
At least the first two you do will leak (don't ask how I know), make sure it's good and clean use rightstuff and really goop up all the corners don't be afraid to use plenty. We took off pans factory installed and found the gray sealer on the pickup tube screen. The corners are most important go back and forth across the lip there not just a bead.
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mastertech
Advanced Member

233 Posts

Posted - 03/16/2013 :  04:17:56 AM  Show Profile  Visit mastertech's Homepage  Reply with Quote
One thing I have found is to cut the small lip off the front and rear flange of the pan to give that extra clearance to help slide the pan in between bell housing and the front saddle. I find the international waker gray rubberized silicone as the best material but like mentioned before it will only stick to a oil free surface. That seems to be the biggest issue with oil pans. Before I stick the pan back up the block gets a final wipe down and the junction of the block and ends get a light smear of silicone as well as the ends. With the small lips of the pan trimmed off you can also see if you get full contact and push out on the whole pan.
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C.HARDY
Advanced Member

350 Posts

Posted - 03/18/2013 :  7:49:41 PM  Show Profile  Click to see C.HARDY's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
put it on thick especially in the rear. I learned the hard way too. I got the silicone that international said use and put it on thick maybe an inch or more and yes let it cure for a little bit.

"Hardybusman"
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Big John
Active Member

USA
15 Posts

Posted - 03/19/2013 :  07:03:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
On our old 444's I had the best luck with Permatex "The Right Stuff". As previous posters said that gray stuff IC sends is only good for making a mess, nothing else. Make sure all surfaces are super clean and dry. Reseal with the right stuff and you shouldn't leak again. The only downside to this gasket maker I have found is if you need to get the pan back off its a bear!!!

Big John
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Derbybug
Active Member

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 03/20/2013 :  04:57:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have done about 2 dozen of the 444 oil pans over the years and have never had one come back due to a re-leak. I use the International RTV Rubber Silicone supplied with the kit. Cleanliness is key to success on this job. Cleaning out the bolt holes is important. Proper torque on the bolts will prevent bending of the flange, which will cause a leak. I let the newly installed pan sit overnight without any oil in it to allow the silicone to set. This job is a pain the the rear but if done carefully and correctly, you will only have to do it once. Im sure "Right Stuff" is a good product to use, however the OEM product is a good product as well. Just take your time and attention to detail is imperative to success on this job.
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jeepcjron
Advanced Member

USA
259 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2013 :  08:54:16 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
moroso performance just released a silicone gasket that works with the stock pan or with their new coated corrision free oil pan

its like a slinky! useless but fun to watch.
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wrench slinger
Active Member

36 Posts

Posted - 04/12/2013 :  03:09:11 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
just did one the other day,i cleaned and cleaned let it sit and it did not leak, but next one i do were going to use the moroso gasket, looks like it might do the trick
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efkimes
Active Member

31 Posts

Posted - 04/12/2013 :  05:32:35 AM  Show Profile  Send efkimes a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
I use the International sealer also and have never had a leak. But the dealer here gave us a tip that helps, we plug in the block heater for 24 hours before putting the oil in. It heates the block and really helps it to cure on the inside also.
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mastertech
Advanced Member

233 Posts

Posted - 04/12/2013 :  10:57:58 PM  Show Profile  Visit mastertech's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The waker gray sealant (IH factory stuff) if installed on a clean dry surface has proven to do very well . Id also ditch the oring on the oil pan adapter and just fill in the area with the rubberized silicone and you wont have failures from the oring swelling and blowing out.
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torque
Senior Member

Canada
71 Posts

Posted - 06/28/2013 :  5:04:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Interesting, working on T444E's in Internationals, 3800 chassis in a school bus fleet, and at a Ford dealership on E350 chassis, I was always taught to use only the special grey sealer to prevent aeration or foaming of the oil. Making sure both surfaces are clean, oil free and dry, I have never had a come back using it. (Fingers crossed) Also, at the Ford dealership I never had the luxury of allowing the sealant to cure any more than a couple of hours while I finished assembly of the vehicle as the customer was picking up the vehicle that night.
So a couple of questions come to mind, has no one using other than the specified sealer had problems related with oil aeration? And, is surface preparation or forgiving sealants really the key to a successful job?
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C.HARDY
Advanced Member

350 Posts

Posted - 07/01/2013 :  6:20:58 PM  Show Profile  Click to see C.HARDY's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
I think taking time to prepare and clean is key element.

"Hardybusman"
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Farmridge
Senior Member

51 Posts

Posted - 07/02/2013 :  03:31:45 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here is a link to order the MOROSO oil pan gasket for the 444 engine. It is also reusable.

http://www.klmstore.com/moroso-ford-73l-powerstroke-international-t444e-oil-pan-gasket.aspx

If you can't handle the answer, don't ask the question
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topwater
New Member

2 Posts

Posted - 07/09/2013 :  09:22:25 AM  Show Profile  Visit topwater's Homepage  Reply with Quote
have run into this several times and ended up being rear main seal housing gask leaking. to find problem i pulled trans and ran eng with oil dye to conferm
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