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 How often do you change your oil and why?
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  09:24:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
When I started with this district over 15 years ago the oil on all busses was being changed at 2000 miles. I have increased that by 50% and have never really given it much thought untill a budget crisis hit. When I say crisis that is what I mean. The state of Illinois owes our transportation department in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. And that is on a district that has just under 200 students in high school. (our district is Pre-k through 12) It's that way all over the state. The only difference is that the southern part of the state depends on the state aid money more than the northern part.

I digress. With this budget pinch I have been pondering where to save money. So the oil change intervals have been surfacing in my mind off and on.

Besides the answer to the question of how often and why I would like to know if anyone has an opinion on what milage is just right? In other words at what point does it become too long and what point is too short? Is it a fine line or more like a wide open field?

I realize that much of the oil change interval descision has to do with route length, average speed, number of stop, and ambient conditions.

I personally have never given much weight to what is said about oil changes in the owner's manual. The companies that write these are, after all, selling new vehicles.

Your thoughts would be much apreciated.

thomasguy
Active Member

Canada
21 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  09:34:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit thomasguy's Homepage  Reply with Quote
We change oil every 9000 miles (15000 km) on the electronic engines Mercedes MBE 900, Cat 3126, DT 466E and Cummins ISC. All others: Cummins C, DT 466, Cat 3116 just over 7000 miles (12000 km)

The manufacturers specify a much longer interval since the new CJ4 oil has entered the market for emmission equipped engines, there's no comparing the price of oil/filters to engine life.

We use CJ4 oil on all our units just to keep it simple compared to having 2 different oils to look after.

School Bus Maintenance & Repairs.
http://schoolbusmechanic.blogspot.com
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  11:16:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hi guys, we change our oils at 50000 km's(30,000 miles), oil testing at 25000 km's, all filters including bypass filters at 12,000 km's,,we only use synthetics up here in canada..we have never had a engine failure!!!!!since 1993,,,amsoil synthetic only,,all our lubes trans,diff, grease everywhere synthetic!!!it does pay for itself in the long run!

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!

Edited by - wright11 on 03/23/2009 11:22:51 AM
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origcharger
Top Member

United States
619 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  12:26:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
On our full size buses that run 20,000 miles per year or less we change our oil twice a year and don't worry about the mileage.
On our Thomas Minitour E450 that runs up to 36,000 per year we change it every 7,000-7,500 miles.

Why you ask? Because this best fits the manufacturers recommendations.

Operating; Seven T444Es, One MaxxForce 7, One VT365, Four DT466s, One E-450 6.0 and one Mercedes in a C2.

Edited by - origcharger on 03/23/2009 12:28:33 PM
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Trailboss
Senior Member

United States
149 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  1:00:25 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
We change our oil twice a during the school year. I retired from the public school where we changed oil and filters twice a year. Our longest route ran just about 15000 miles a year. Most of our roads are county roads,dirt,sand,and gravel.I had oil analisses done after school is out and befor oil change. Reports came back okay.
We don't use synthedic oil but use a very good quality of oil and oil filters.
I am now working at a Vo Tech and have changed our oil change interval to twice yearly also. Our buses at the Vo Tech are all highway miles and run closer to 20000 per year.
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second.flood
Advanced Member

USA
382 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  3:01:31 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
450 hrs.
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lonebustech
Senior Member

United States
79 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  3:19:02 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I change it at 10,000 miles on the real buses(DTA360,T444e,VT365,and the Maxforce 7) and 3,000 on our Chevy 6.5. I ran a few oil samples when I started here and the oil was still good at this point

22 Buses,18 support vehicles,Grounds equip, buffers and vacuums for 9 campuses. 1 Tech. and 2 bays ain't life grand
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ModMech
Top Member

USA
948 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  3:41:52 PM  Show Profile  Visit ModMech's Homepage  Reply with Quote
10,000 miles; 1,100 gallons or 450 hours, whichever comes first.

Generally this means every 90 days with "dry" PMs at 45 days.

If you want customer service, you NEED an International!
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IBTMech
Top Member

USA
973 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2009 :  6:06:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit IBTMech's Homepage  Reply with Quote
We do our School bus and Public Works oil changes at 5000 mi. I know we could go much longer but after years of trying to get the Admin to do it by fuel consumption I have given up. We have a nice computerized fuel system but Admin sez we'd just be making more work for them.

We bring them in at 2500 mi. for lube and inspection. Any longer than that and we'll have air brake clevis pins seizing up here in the rust belt.

If it doesn't fit, FORCE it.
If it breaks, well, it needed replacing anyway.
Pullin' wrenches for 45 years.

Edited by - IBTMech on 03/24/2009 5:54:26 PM
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Wolf0r
Top Member

USA
2179 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2009 :  1:22:37 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
We do our diesels at 6000miles, and the gas at 3000. Works out to 2x a school year and once in the summer break, on the diesels. They get a once over (noting repairs needed)and a brake inspection as well. That way I can wait till my parts get here and not have to stick the driver in a temp. I use URSA in all of them.

“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2009 :  1:29:05 PM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Bwest, (& thomasguy, wright11, origcharger, trailboss, second.flood, lonebustech, ModeMech, IBT Mech)

This has been a question that has been pondered for over a hundred years since lube maintenance was first seriously attempted with the advent of the rail road.

A three part short answer is:
1. Your experience and observations are absolutely correct.
2. The here to fore technology used to measure a lubricants ability to lubricate is complex and often confusing or worse.
3. Help is on the way.

To explain this further, there are numerous factors that play a role in determining the condemning limits of a lubricant. One such attempt was performed by General Motors which spent ten years researching the problem and patented an “Oil-Life System” (“GM’s Oil-Life System Improves Timing of Oil Changes”. Practicing Oil Analysis Magazine. January 1999). This system monitors key external factors that effect the degradation of oil. These factors include engine operating temperature, mileage, number of engine revolutions, engine load, and others. These factors were correlated against accepted oil analysis tests such as “total base number (TBN), total acid number (TAN), and pentane insoluble’s test (PIN) from which a highly sophisticated mathematical model was constructed. This model was incorporated in the programming of the vehicles on board computer system and called an “Oil-Life System”. The outcome of this system is that it turns on the “change oil message” when it determines a condemning limit.

This system suffers from the same short comings as all the other oil life monitoring systems and tests. They all measure lubricity indirectly. They look at “symptoms” of oil degradation but not one of them measures lubricity directly. There are several lubricity tests based upon scuff marks the BOCLE test ), (HFRR) High Frequency Reciprocating Rig). These lubricity tests rub one metal against another in the presence of a lubricant to produce a scuff mark. The scuff mark is then analyzed to determine the lubricity of the lubricant. These tests are laboratory based destructive in nature, and expensive, which make them impractical for determining oil life. What one seemingly identical engine can run healthy on after 10,000 miles another can have minor damage after 3,000 miles when all factors seem to be the same. And yes, you are correct, of course the manufactures are going to recommend a change after 2,000 miles, not only is it the safe bet, but it makes them more money too.

Actually this problem has been solved less than 2 years ago with a break through technology that we developed at Wilkris Company. We have the only portable audit gauge on the market that directly measures the lubricity of your oil allowing you within 90 seconds to view as a percentage, the exact remaining oil life of all your lubricants. In other words, you can use our portable Digistick to test an entire fleet of buses and it can tell you the exact moment when your oil ceases to be of value as a lubricant. Feel free to contact me Todd at 513.271.9344 or at todd@wilkris.com
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2009 :  6:25:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
thank wilkris, but i think i will trust my oil analysis company, that i have trusted for the last 15 years,

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2009 :  4:10:16 PM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Wright 11, Is it my understanding that you use bypass filters? Could they possibly be Harvard filters by some chance? If so could you let me know?
Bill Van Ee
Wilkris Co.
vaneew@wilkris.com

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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  07:35:30 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hi wilkris, seeing we are an amsoil distributor, we only use amsoil products.. we are a distributor only to get the best pricing, and we do not sell out of house. our cost is roughly half price of retail.
our bypass, including all filtration is amsoil, all engine oil, lube oils, greases=AMSOIL!!we have very few failures of any components. some of our engines have gone 110,000 km's between oil changes, but the average is 50,000 km's, but please remember oil testing is crucial, we also service our units at 6000 km intervals(grease, chk, oil,brakes tires and anything else the driver wants done), and filter changes(all) at 12,000 km's..our fleet is made up of , gas 366-454, dual fuel 366-454, propane 366, diesel mercedes, ic 360, cummins 5.9 12 and 24 valve, ic 466, ic 365, and 08 ic 466..we have learned the hard way never to use conventional lubes, and we NEVER use the guidelines of the manufacturer. when we do spec buses, when we get delivery, the conventional oil and lubes are removed as soon as possible, and replaced with synthetics!!! Oil testing is very cheap insurance to get the longer drain intervals, which keeps the overall cost down.
And guys i am not trying to sell you on synthetics, but in my fleet, it does work. And i do realize there is so many variables from fleet to fleet, that there is no one proven effective calculation on how often one should change oil, with your fleets you are probably right in doing what you are doing, if it works for you!!! I am only stating what works for us up in canada ( -40c to +30c)
and just one other point, why do the manufactures like allison, eaton,ect, run only synthetics in their cases??? do they know something you don't?
the way we found out is to have 2 new sister buses, one on conventional, one on synthetic, change oil as recomended on conventional, do oil testing on the synthetic. After 2-3 years do a cost analysis.please take into account, the oil cost, labour, downtime, you will see a difference

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!

Edited by - wright11 on 03/26/2009 08:20:38 AM
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  08:52:39 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I am wondering if the product that Wilkris is selling is for testing oil. The little time that I got to see their web site I really couldn't surmize what exactly was going on. Maybe Bill will let us know. I don't know what the rules are here on the forum, (about selling things) but I for one would like to know what he is talking about. I hope we don't get in trouble. If we do, it's my fault for bringing it up.

Bryan
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  09:06:27 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hi bwest, mtself i would wish the sellers goto a seller forum or something like that, so us mech. can have this forum to talk about tech stuff, like i thought it was. i have had many reps come through our shop selling their wares, and what usually shuts them down is when i bring out our oil analysis sheet,,,then they leave!!

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  09:16:49 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can see your point but I kind of walked into his area when I ask the question. I "would" be upset if it was unsolicited. If this helps us do our job better or saves time and money what would it hurt?

Bryan
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  12:12:52 PM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
wilkris
New Member,


Hi again bwest and wright 11,

It is not my intention to offend anyone by being in your forum. What you have to say is a great deal of interest to me and I appreciate very much the candid discussions about real world problems like “When should I change my oil?” Fluids, especially lubricants, are subjects that I’ve had a great deal of interest in for some time, primarily from an engineering standpoint. However; my practical experience relative to lubricants, compared to yours is quite limited, and that is why I turn to forums such as this to better educate myself. I will try to contribute to this forum in a positive manner and try not to offend anyone.

Wright 11, I read your reply to the filter question and it certainly correlates with everything I’ve heard from people that I know and trust in the automotive and other industries.

Your skepticism is quite warranted and the numerous other points you brought up are well made. Especially the point about “oil testing” being “crucial”. The testing of lube oil has been a key area of interest of mine for the last several years. It has also made me very skeptical of many of the testing methods in use today. The objective of testing lube oil is to detect a failing lubricant before it causes damage. The Technical Academy in Esslingen Germany (TAE) published a study in 2000 of the root causes for bearing failures. This study found that 20% were do to unsuitable lubricants, 20% due to solid impurities in the lubricants, 5% due to liquid impurties in the lubricants, 20% due to old (oxidized) lubricants and 15% due to lack of lubricants, to make the grand total of 80%. Poor lubrication is the root causes of 80% of bearing failures. Based upon your experience, would you agree with this study?
Would it also be safe to say that if 80% of bearing failures are lube related then overall machine failures will probably be lubricated related?

In addition to above study “A frequently cited study from M.I.T. estimates that six to seven percent of America’s Gross National Product $240 billion is spent repairing machinery damaged from wear caused by poor lubrication. It’s a figure that is at once astounding and completely understandable.” Taken from Processing Magazine May 2006. Having looked at these studies, and many more, I have come to the conclusion that if we know the root causes of machine failures then the methods we are using to deal with them are not working. What do you think?
Best regards, Wilkris.
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Mechan1c
Top Member

USA
699 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2009 :  4:01:43 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My expectation with my 2007-09 DT466/MaxxForceDT's is that they will last the 13 years that they need to with no engine failures. I expect with Delvac1, used-filter inspections, and oil analysis, that I will have ZERO lubrication failures. My CAT SOS lab checks for all of the above "root causes" like fuel dilution, presence of coolant, wear metals, soot, and oxidation. TBN and viscosity results tell you what usable life you have left in the oil. In terms of the original question of oil change intervals, each engine family and model will be different. Like my CAT 3208/3116/3126/C7's, the Internationals OCI's will need to be watched and adjusted to account for their unique characteristics. High expectations I know; we'll see how they do.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  07:57:41 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I also expect my engines to last about 13 years but with the way things are going with funding I fully expect that I will be keeping these units much loner. I think that I need to be looking to add 25%-30% of life to these units before I can replace them. If we don't come out of this rough spot for a wile I may be adding even more years to them. It doesn't look very good for the home team. Our state says that it does not have the funds to meet the amount that was legislated. That means that our superintendent made a budget based on what the legislature promised. Now we have made purchases for part of the year with money we could be using now if we would have known we were not going to get it. I am holding out hope but it is quickly dimming. These people in office that were elected by the people both in our state and the nation have no idea what they are doing. I say if they are not trying to cut frivalous spending at evey turn and lowering taxes to spur business then we need to throw them out!

Sorry, I'll back off. I just am having a hard time figuring out the priorities of our elected officials.

Bryan
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Mechan1c
Top Member

USA
699 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  08:44:46 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Your original post says 2k and then you added 50% (1k). Your HD diesels should go well beyond that. If you use Mod's above intervals you should be well within your safety zone. We used to change oil at 6K 10 years ago and were draining a lot of perfectly good oil. We doubled that fleet wide with some engine families going out to 15K. Word's still out on the DTs. What kind of oil are you using?
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  09:33:22 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks Mechan1c, I use a regular 15w40 non-synthetic. I was thinking of increasing to 6K but I would like to gradually go there. I guess a couple of obsticals for me are that in the past my district has looked at testing oil as a waste of money. Now don't get the idea that I think that. I have just not felt like going into that battle (I'm sure you know how it can be). Now that prices are up on everything and the funding is waining I guess I need to get my armor on. The second obstical is I sort of have a crutch now. I am just one guy taking care of 17 buses, two lawn tractors, one small loader tractor, two vans, two trucks, the parking lot, many maintenance issues at our buildings, calls about student's take home location, new student bussing, you get the point. With all that going on, it's easy to just let the oil go past my self imposed miles a little.

Back to the point, if you use synthetic oil do you use an oil analysis evey time you change the oil? If I wanted to continue with non-synthetic should I send in an analysis every change? It seems to me that I would be ahead of where I am now to increase to 6K, keep the non-synthetic, and use an analysis.

Any thoughts are apreciated.

Bryan
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Mechan1c
Top Member

USA
699 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  1:10:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, we sample every oil change. With new engines we sample on our way up before drains to see how the oil is going to do and establish an inteval. We learned there are great differences in oil condition than what we expected in our newest engines. We are also sampling our Allison transmissions that were factory filled with Transynd to see how thats going to work long term. (So far the ATF is pristine after 2 1/2 years) When you sample all drains you get really accurate baselines and when an engine does have an issue it really sticks out. (an example is a failed air/fuel ratio control valve) You also gain trending data as the engines wear that help establish other PM's like valve adjustments and bearing roll-ins.

We used oil analysis even when we used 15W40 Delvac1300. We also feel getting early warnings on coolant contamination from head-gasket failures and oil coolers, presence of dirt, fuel dilution, and big spikes in metals helps justify the cost of the oil samples. We've learned things accidentally like what happens to the oil when you blow a hose and overheat severely. (Overheats are where synthetics are worth the extra cost)

You could sample at 2K intervals over what you now drain at, and if the oil's good and you don't drain and change filters you've gained quite a bit. Usually the determining drain factors are TBN, viscosity and soot. You could then quit sampling and call it good if you think that the boss doesn't support the cost. Or, this may help convince even the most stingy boss that maybe this is a good idea. 15W40 at 6K and a sample before draining might convince everyone that 8K is attainable and quite cost effective. Let us know what you do.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  2:02:23 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think that is a great idea. I haven't talked to anyone about this subject in a long time. Time just goes by fast when you have lots of things going on, as we all know.

When you sample when not draining do you just pull it out at the drain plug or out of the dipstick somehow? Seems like I saw or heard one time that there was a tool, with a small hose, to pull from the dipstick tube. Anyway I'm sure you have a technique, Mechan1c, as many times as it sounds like you have done it.

When I use to send in oil for analysis it was done through NAPA. Does anyone know if there is a difference between NAPA and say Caterpillar? I know price would probably be one difference.

Again thoughts from anyone is appreciated.

Bryan
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Mechan1c
Top Member

USA
699 Posts

Posted - 03/27/2009 :  3:20:43 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
2 ways to sample: Hose down the dipstick tube with a suction device or, a live sample valve at a port that will vary by make and model. A needle-like device with a tube inserts into the valve. Here's a link showing how we do the Allison samples with the live port method:

http://www.allisontransmission.com/servlet/DownloadOnDemand?ApplicationID=155&DownloadID=13

Here's how to do a sample the CAT way:

http://www.cat.com/cda/files/89957/7/pehp6001.pdf



As far as who to go to for samples my choices are a CAT dealer with a SOS lab, or Mobil's Accutrack kit that can be purchased from a commercial Mobil dealer. I've used Baldwin's program, but that was about 15 years ago...For Transmissions Allison's kit P/N 29537805 works well.

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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 03/31/2009 :  1:57:20 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
OK I've been talking to my superintendent and he is asking a few questions. Lets say I pull a sample at 3000 miles and Cat says go to 4500 then I pull another one and they say go to 6000 and then I pull another one and they say change it. Is this worth the time or should I just change it at say 4000 and sample it then. Then say the next time I change it go to 6000 if warrented and continue on that way? Cat says 250 hours is the recomended change interval. Then one of the guys there, who also is on a local school board (not mine), says that I can probably take it up to 6000 anyway. But I am afraid to go that far with out knowing about the oil quality or contaminants. Cat says the analysis will cost $15. Is this all worth the time and effort in your opinion.

I think I want to go with the first example if I can justify it.

Any and all comments welcome.

Bryan
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B. Busguy33
Top Member

USA
3444 Posts

Posted - 03/31/2009 :  2:50:11 PM  Show Profile  Visit B. Busguy33's Homepage  Send B. Busguy33 an AOL message  Send B. Busguy33 a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
I operate a 2004 Intl/BB 3800, DT466. It probably doesn't see much more than 5,000 miles per year. How often would you recommend an oil change for this bus?
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  05:12:43 AM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Original Questions. #1 How often do I change oil?
#2 why?

Answers to the original questions.
#1 You should change your oil when the lubricity (elastohydrodynamic film)drops below 80% of it's original reading, this will provide you with a 20% saftey margin.

#2 Lubricity is the common denominator of all liquid lubricants, it defines the condition of the EHD film that forms the barrier between the moving parts. After all, it is this film with a thickness ranging between 0.0002" (two ten-thousandths) to 0.004 (four thousandths)of an inch that does all the lubricating. Milage, heat, partical count, total acid number, total base number, viscosity, and many other tests with all kinds of measurments are secondary measurements of lubricity. For the most part they measure symptoms caused by changes in the lubricity, but they do not measure the condition of the film directly.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  05:20:48 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I know there are some on this forum that don't like to talk about products that are for sale from a forum member. That being said I am going to ask this question anyway. This product you have, is it a tool to check the oil in the field or what is it exactly? With out getting into too much detail.

Bryan
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  05:46:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hey bryan, i think he just wants hits on his website, so he can get more traffic there!!!

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  06:07:25 AM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I agree that this forum should be directed at sharing information and not flogging products. In this spirit I will try to answer the questions as briefly as possible. Yes there is a tool that directly measures lubricity (EHD). It is portable and designed for shop and field use. It is a hydrostatic gauge that looks like a dip stick. You dip it in a sample of oil and 90 seconds later you have a direct measurement of the lubricity.
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  08:49:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
OK, lubricity but no other measurments like metals or silica. I think that answers my question.
Thanks

Bryan
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  08:59:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
wilkris, will this work on my lawnmower, because thats the only equipment i would use it on,,but then i would just change the oil!!!please take your trinkets to some other site!!

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!
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bwest
Administrator

United States
2347 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  09:30:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Down boy!!

Bryan
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wright11
Senior Member

Canada
159 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  09:36:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
work stress must be getting to me, thank god its easter break, i need a day off, sorry guys!!!

I'D WOULD RATHER BE CUMMIN THAN STROKIN ! ! ! !
I.C no future!!
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Wilkris
New Member

United States
7 Posts

Posted - 04/09/2009 :  09:59:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit Wilkris's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The best strategy Ive heard of so far is:#1 use only synthetic oils, #2 Change engine lube oil at 30,000 miles if required,#3 Lab test oil at 15000 miles, #4 Have both full-flow and partial-pass filters on every vehicle,#5 Change both types of oil filters every 7,000 miles.
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