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BBInt.10
Top Member
USA
1042 Posts |
 Posted - 03/18/2009 : 5:43:20 PM
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We all know there are some times when the child checkmate is more of a pain than a help. One of those times is when I get to the elementary school in the morning. We're supposed to sit there and wait until the teachers come out before letting the kids off the bus. This can be anywhere up to about a 5 minute wait. With the idling law, we're not supposed to idle more than 3 minutes unless it's colder than 20 degrees. For the last few years, I've had my kids trained to lift the emergency door handle after I shut down the bus to disarm the checkmate while I wait at the school. I know a number of other drivers did the same thing.
Well today at our safety meeting, we were informed of how to override the checkmate system in situations like this so we neither need to get out of our seat, or use a student to disarm it. After you secure the bus (shift into neutral, apply parking brake), push the red override button turning on your red lights. Then, you can turn your bus to the "off" position. Your red lights will remain on, and your checkmate WILL NOT start beeping at you. Then, you can turn the bus to the "on" position. Your red lights will go off, but then you are free to turn on your ambers while you sit there and wait, and you can operate your door like normal.
I know there are probably a bunch of people out there that already know about this, but I just wanted to share this with anyone (like me and everyone else at my lot) who has been driving an IC for years and was not aware of it. |
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Lifestar Fe
Top Member
United States
521 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 7:30:48 PM
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| I was wondering how they did it! With the driver escort law here, that would be a big pain to walk to the back every time! I wonder if they put that override in there specifically to meet Ca demands...since the reds have to be on. |
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BusAce12
Active Member
United States
24 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2009 : 2:50:57 PM
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| Oh really now?? I drive a bus like described..and noone ever taught me that trick...I must try that tomorrow! Thanks a bunch for that info! |
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bluebirdvision
Top Member
USA
1081 Posts |
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NathanW
Advanced Member
United States
313 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2009 : 5:48:30 PM
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| I drive an older bus where the rear door isn't hooked up to it. We just have a button above the rear seat. I've trained the kids to push the button for me if need be. They love to do it as it makes a lot of noise. I've been told if we switch the keys from "on" to "off" then to "accessory" the alarm will not sound. |
Nathan--Driver Extraordinaire |
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1983WardFord
Top Member
USA
1395 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2009 : 3:35:13 PM
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Good call there.
I just wish there was a way to disable it completely. Sometimes when the kiddies get too unruly, I like to pull off to the side of the road and shut off the bus (or if I need to go toward the back of the bus). Can't do that with the check-mate thing once you've picked up or dropped off a student. I'd rather not teach my kids to mess with the door in situations like that. |
Due to the current economic condition, the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned off until further notice. |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2009 : 9:01:24 PM
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| Are your states requiring the Child Checkmate systems? If they aren't you can de-spec the option when ordering the bus if it is standard. |
If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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origcharger
Top Member
United States
619 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 08:52:03 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by BBInt.10
We all know there are some times when the child checkmate is more of a pain than a help. One of those times is when I get to the elementary school in the morning. We're supposed to sit there and wait until the teachers come out before letting the kids off the bus. This can be anywhere up to about a 5 minute wait. With the idling law, we're not supposed to idle more than 3 minutes unless it's colder than 20 degrees.
Not so sure if the problem is the child check systems or the idle reduction policy/laws?
Many of these idle reduction policies/rules/laws appear to have been written by people who have never driven a school bus. The degree cut off point is laughable, if its 19 degrees you can let it run but if its 20 you have to shut it down? Shut it down after 3 and the windows/windshield fogs over, then you have to run it a few minutes before you pull away so you can see? Why not a relative humidity or dew point cutoff also?
No law here but we do have an idle reduction policy and set the temperature at 30 degrees and the time at 7 minutes which would seem to allow a bit more use of good ole common sense.
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Operating; Seven T444Es, One MaxxForce 7, One VT365, Four DT466s, One E-450 6.0 and one Mercedes in a C2. |
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NathanW
Advanced Member
United States
313 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 08:55:08 AM
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| We have specific temps we're supposed to go by, but I go by comfort. If it's freezing outside and the bus is freezing inside I'm going to keep running the bus until it's warm. However, if it's freezing outside and the bus is warm inside I'll shut it down until it gets freezing inside again. |
Nathan--Driver Extraordinaire |
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BBInt.10
Top Member
USA
1042 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 4:34:38 PM
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| I have no problem with the idle reduction laws, I think they come from a good place and that often times there's no good reason to let a diesel sit there and idle. I drive in a rural area so I doubt if the DEP would even ever be at any of the schools I service. Regardless of that, I choose to follow the idle law pretty closely mainly because I think it makes sense. Why create all that pollution and waste all that diesel fuel? There is not a thermometer in the dash telling me the precise outside temperature, so I just go by feel... if it is really cold out then I let the bus and heaters run, but if I think we'd be comfortable even if I shut the bus off, then I shut it off. My car has a thermometer built right into the dash, next to the odometer. I think that's a great safety feature. It lets you know when things can start icing up outside. I think that would be a great spec to start seeing in school buses, not only so you know where you stand with the idle law, but also it may give you a heads up as to when things could start getting slick. |
If all your problems are behind you... you must be a school bus driver. |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 4:45:16 PM
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I don't see the big deal...just turn the key off and turn it back on after the motor stops. It doesn't hurt a thing (on an IC RE anyway)...the hour meter doesn't even continue to run.
I do it numerous times a day as I have a run that has "depot" stops where I sit at schools and wait as the kids trickle in. If it's cold, I like to shut the door between kids and the the key has to be on for the door to work.
There are instances of ChildCheck going haywire and you have to remove the module thing from the electrical panel.
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BusAce12
Active Member
United States
24 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 5:29:13 PM
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| IC, on the buses we are talkin about...u can't just turn the key...as soon as u turn that key..it starts beeping and the headlights flash..and the horn will be next.....unless we use Dave's new trick..the RE's don't have the same checkmates...the Ics wit the controls in the steering wheel, and the back door disarment for the check mate are pains in the @sses |
CrazyAce |
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fsdrvr
Active Member
United States
35 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 6:02:37 PM
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| To add to BusAce's comment, we're talking about two different systems here. IC puts a system in there bus called No Child Left Behind. You might be thinking of the Child CheckMate (which is popular with First Student). They all do the same thing, but they work in two different (but fairly similar) ways. |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 7:06:59 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by origcharger
Not so sure if the problem is the child check systems or the idle reduction policy/laws?
Many of these idle reduction policies/rules/laws appear to have been written by people who have never driven a school bus.
But the government knows best, how dare you question what a shirt and tie in an office says!?!?!?! Not to worry...they have your IP address and hired goons will be arriving soon. Crap, now I've said to much and I bet they will be coming... |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 7:10:31 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC
I don't see the big deal...just turn the key off and turn it back on after the motor stops. It doesn't hurt a thing (on an IC RE anyway)...the hour meter doesn't even continue to run.
What did you do, yank that stupid beeper out? All the Internationals and Freightliners we had would drive you bonkers due to no oil pressure! Or did they finaly rework the system in all of them so it's ECM controlled? That'd be dandy! |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 03/21/2009 : 10:15:45 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
quote:
Originally posted by IC
I don't see the big deal...just turn the key off and turn it back on after the motor stops. It doesn't hurt a thing (on an IC RE anyway)...the hour meter doesn't even continue to run.
What did you do, yank that stupid beeper out? All the Internationals and Freightliners we had would drive you bonkers due to no oil pressure! Or did they finaly rework the system in all of them so it's ECM controlled? That'd be dandy!
No beeping on my bus with the key on....but there is a warning light on the dash that lights up...something weird like "CHECK TRANS".
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IC-RE
Top Member
USA
4117 Posts |
Posted - 03/22/2009 : 9:12:14 PM
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| IC, once in a while I drive one of our new 09's, and normally I drive a 99-02 RE. The 09's are different, you have you hit the button in the back EVEN if the warning lights were not activated. The child check is activated when the key is turned to on... it's a royal PITA |
 bus 1980, a 2008 IC RE 300 for Fairfax County Public Schools, Fairfax, Virginia. |
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Salaskie
Advanced Member
USA
453 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 1:08:42 PM
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How is the person who circumvents the child checkmate system any different than the driver and/or attendant who fails to check the bus for sleeping children? Both are negligent. What happened to all that discussion about "it only takes a moment to..."? I'm embarrassed to be reading that my fellow drivers even consider circumventing the device.
Sad state of affairs :-( |
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Thomasbus24
Administrator
USA
4544 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 3:00:50 PM
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Any volunteers to help with a pilot program of a new left behind child checker-outer system I've designed?
It's a cobination of the Zonar pretrip thing and a house arrest ankle braclet...
When you get in your bus, it wont start until you've attached the device to your leg (senses your pulse), then when you are done, if you don't walk at a reasonably slow pace to the rear of the bus and back to the front (RFID chips throughout), and you attempt to remove it or exit the vehicle you recieve a progressively stronger electic shock for each time you try to cheat the system.
If you are a good little driver, and you perform your post-trip, then it unlocks and you simply remove it and leave it in the bus for the night.
Oh I should add one more chip under the driver floor so nobody tried to stick it on a kid! |
Edited by - Thomasbus24 on 03/24/2009 3:03:02 PM |
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Nick
Advanced Member
USA
333 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 3:22:48 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Thomasbus24
Any volunteers to help with a pilot program of a new left behind child checker-outer system I've designed?
It's a cobination of the Zonar pretrip thing and a house arrest ankle braclet...
When you get in your bus, it wont start until you've attached the device to your leg (senses your pulse), then when you are done, if you don't walk at a reasonably slow pace to the rear of the bus and back to the front (RFID chips throughout), and you attempt to remove it or exit the vehicle you recieve a progressively stronger electic shock for each time you try to cheat the system.
If you are a good little driver, and you perform your post-trip, then it unlocks and you simply remove it and leave it in the bus for the night.
Oh I should add one more chip under the driver floor so nobody tried to stick it on a kid!
Hahaha, don't give them any ideas!  |
IC the future, and it is bright. |
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bluebirdvision
Top Member
USA
1081 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 3:47:00 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Salaskie
How is the person who circumvents the child checkmate system any different than the driver and/or attendant who fails to check the bus for sleeping children? Both are negligent. What happened to all that discussion about "it only takes a moment to..."? I'm embarrassed to be reading that my fellow drivers even consider circumventing the device.
Sad state of affairs :-(
Salaskie, I believe these drivers are not trying to circumvent the child check when it is appropriate to use. They are trying to bypass it when sitting loaded (I.E. Waiting for the school doors to unlock, waiting to load children after preforming pre-trip.
In both instances this system would be annoying. |
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bboth
New Member
Canada
1 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2014 : 12:14:48 PM
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A few things:
- If your bus doesn't have the stop sign button, it's not Child Check-Mate System. If it operates by the door, its not a real Child Check-Mate.
- If you're in CA and there's an escort obligation, Child Check-Mate works by keeping your flashers on (gives you 10 minutes to escort children across the road)
- Child Check-Mate works differently depending on where you are (because states and counties are all creating their own regulations - which makes everything that much more confusing) |
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WayneCustom
Active Member
30 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2014 : 05:12:06 AM
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| I find it funny that IC changed the name of this feature from its original name - No Child Left Behind! |
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IC Child Checkmate Override
