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Peter
Top Member
USA
1057 Posts |
 Posted - 05/13/2005 : 3:52:16 PM
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After reading the topic about auto shifter locations, I started thinking about our fleet a few years back when we had a large number of '80s GMCs with hydraulic brakes. The parking brake lever was to the right of the driver while it is to the left in 3800s, '90s GMCs and Freightliners. We also had TC/2000s with the lever brake, the pedal brake and air brakes. As a standby, I drove a different bus - sometimes as many as four - every day and I was forever searching for the parking brake in the wrong place. I liked those old GMCs but think that the brake lever to the right was goofy and should have been to the left. Apparently they thought so, too as they put it there in the CV200.
So, what type of parking brake control do you folks prefer? I suspect that air brakes will win by a landslide, but we'll see. |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 6:50:10 PM
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Air brakes, please! Although in the new IC CE, and Blue Bird International even hydraulic brakes have the same knob, which is nice.
As far as levers go, I hate them, and have never really found one that I thought was in a good place.
New Jersey actually requires that levers for hydraulic brakes be to the right of the driver. This is quite interesting... on 3800s and FS-65s the brake is just to the right of the driver's seat. While this is convenient for the driver, I don't like the location overall since it would be so easy for a kid to knock the brake off when walking by.
Here is what a Vision looks like with New Jersey's brake requirement:
That bus also has a "P" on the shifter, which would mean park, although I don't know if that is really the case or not, as it was parked in neutral as always, with the brake on.
All the Vision photos are at: http://www.schoolbuscentral.com/gallery/archived/jun04/bb_5_vis_05_nj.htm
Photos © 2005 School Bus Central, Richard Solano. |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 7:29:15 PM
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| All our parking brake knobs (all are air brakes) are on the right....easily accessible to the passengers. We are actually supposed to tell the passengers how to operate it, in case we have a heart attack or sumpin while driving. |
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JC Theriault
Top Member
Canada
1326 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 8:30:50 PM
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Rich - A kid would have to first push down on that "safety catch" that you see half way along the handle to release the parking brake. In that case I'm not so sure 'accidental' would be an appropriate term if a kid went through the trouble of releasing it!
JC |
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School Bus M8
Top Member
USA
617 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 9:55:35 PM
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| I liked the switch that the hydrallic fords used to have. |
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BusFreak
Top Member
USA
798 Posts |
Posted - 05/13/2005 : 11:15:26 PM
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| Virginia actually requires alot of things to be to the right of the driver for the very reason IC mentioned. Everything from parking break levers/knobs to warning light switches. On the 3800s on VA with hydraulic brakes, the lever is through the floor, right next to where the stick would come out of the floor for a 5 speed (which hydraulic brakes usually accompany). I'm sure that if there were any Visions in VA with hydraulic brakes in VA, they would look just like that NJ spec one Richard has shown us all |
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IC RE 1629
Top Member
United States
5097 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 04:50:07 AM
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I think a parking brake knob on the right side it nicer than if it was on the left.
IC...as for telling the passengers how to use it, not one driver has ever told me or anyone else on my bus how to use it. I learned from watching. |
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Chris
Top Member
USA
1013 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 06:20:16 AM
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I love air brakes, I'm glad they are most popular in my area, and that my school has a fleet of all-air-braked buses. As far as placement, I like the setup that IC currently has. The parking brake and shifter are in easy reach of the driver, now they just need to put the door controls in the same area I think.
I have never been told how to operate the parking brake (didn't need to be either). And with "PARKING BRAKE" written in the center of all new yellow knobs with "PULL TO APPLY PUSH TO RELEASE" written around it, I would hope someone could figure it out. |
My Personal Fleet
1985 Ward Ford #1 Lexington Local - 1990 Wayne International NO.2 Walton-Verona - 1992 Ward Senator NO.4 Walton-Verona *SOLD* |
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Peter
Top Member
USA
1057 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 09:07:51 AM
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| I just remembered that one of the Laidlaw operations in this area has a batch of '95 Carpenter/IHs with hydraulic brakes (and ATs) with the brake lever sticking up out of the floor above the transmission, like BusFreak described. Those are the only newer buses I've ever seen with that setup. Seems like a long reach. |
Spicer is nicer. |
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Isellbuses
Top Member
Canada
828 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 09:32:37 AM
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I think the IC parking brake for hydralics makes the most sense.
Do your states require you to apply the brake when you load on a run? |
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IC-RE
Top Member
USA
4117 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 11:18:54 AM
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| Like IC said, it is better for passenger safety to have the brake on the right, every single bus I have ever been assigned to, on the first day of school the driver has always told us where the brake is, and what to do in case of an emergencey. They also tell us to grab the radio, key the mic and wait 3 seeconds before speaking. We are then instructeed to say... This is bus XXX, we are in an emergency and then give location. I feel that this is very important. I was sloe a safety patrol a few years back, and as part of our training, all the patrols in my school boarded a bus, and we went out on the road, and each patrol was forced to pull the lever while the bus was in motion and then call in on the radio. (these were when we had the old radios, so we could switch to a clear channel, and it was in the summer when less drivers were on the road) |
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Peter
Top Member
USA
1057 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 11:34:27 AM
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quote:
I think the IC parking brake for hydralics makes the most sense.
Most people are getting the air applied parking brake on the '05 CEs and BB/3300s but the standard parking brake for hydraulics on this model is a small lever like you'd find in a little car mounted on the floor to the right of the driver. Anyone else seen this? I've only seen it on one demo. |
Spicer is nicer. |
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Cody
Top Member
United States
1630 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 12:11:32 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Peter
quote:
I think the IC parking brake for hydralics makes the most sense.
Most people are getting the air applied parking brake on the '05 CEs and BB/3300s but the standard parking brake for hydraulics on this model is a small lever like you'd find in a little car mounted on the floor to the right of the driver. Anyone else seen this? I've only seen it on one demo.
They don't use that small lever anymore. Now the hydralic brakes are just like the air brakes, w/ the yellow knob. |
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whe8913
Advanced Member
United States
301 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 12:14:48 PM
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| I really like the IHC parking brake levers that are on the left side of the driver. You pull it up to release it and pull it down to apply it. All there is to it. It even has the little ball knob to adjust the tension. Being on the left like that, they were less prone to having kids mess with them, and most non-school bus drivers did not even know what they were- heck we even had some school bus drivers get in a hydraulic brake bus and not figure out how to release the brake. The ONLY thing I did not like about these levers was the fact that they often "rode down" continuously and they always end up resting on my knee, and I have to shove it back up. |
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BlueBird44
Top Member
USA
1639 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 1:43:43 PM
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| I prefer the air parking brake knob. Currently I am driving a hydralic brake bus and I hate the parking brake lever it won't always stays up and it gets on my knee and I have to push it back up. I don't like the fact of leaning over to release it. It's so much easier just to pull an push the air brake button. |
IC-The Golden Shield of School Transportation |
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Rich
Top Member
United States
5768 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 4:17:10 PM
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quote:
the standard parking brake for hydraulics on this model is a small lever like you'd find in a little car mounted on the floor to the right of the driver. Anyone else seen this? I've only seen it on one demo.
That setup was only on the first prototypes of the IC CEs and Blue Bird 3300s... now it is the parking brake that is similar to the air brakes. |
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IC
Top Member
USA
3413 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 7:07:39 PM
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Isellbuses asked..."Do your states require you to apply the brake when you load on a run?"
That is a very interesting question, and one I have wondered about. My district has no such requirement, and I don't usually do it on level or even uphill pavement. But one of my runs has 4 stops on a pretty steep (downhill) grade and students cross in front of the bus at 3 of them. One day, as I was watching my little ones cross in front of the bus, I wondered "what if" my foot slipped off the brake, or heaven forbid, I were to pass out right at the exact moment that they are directly in front of the bus?
I ALWAYS pull the brake knob at those 3 stops..... |
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Isellbuses
Top Member
Canada
828 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 7:25:18 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by IC
Isellbuses asked..."Do your states require you to apply the brake when you load on a run?"
That is a very interesting question, and one I have wondered about. My district has no such requirement, and I don't usually do it on level or even uphill pavement. But one of my runs has 4 stops on a pretty steep (downhill) grade and students cross in front of the bus at 3 of them. One day, as I was watching my little ones cross in front of the bus, I wondered "what if" my foot slipped off the brake, or heaven forbid, I were to pass out right at the exact moment that they are directly in front of the bus?
I ALWAYS pull the brake knob at those 3 stops.....
That is great. I think it makes sense to apply the brake. It is not law here in Quebec or Canada, but, I have heard it is the law in some States. Is this true? |
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JC Theriault
Top Member
Canada
1326 Posts |
Posted - 05/14/2005 : 8:27:08 PM
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It isn't law in NB or NS either, possibly due to the fact that many of the fleets out here still have hydraulic brakes and that would mean a lot of repetitive action/physical effort by the drivers. Or it could be because neither of these two provinces have ever had an accident caused by a bus moving forward under its own power with its red lights activated. Plus if I recall correctly both provinces driver handbooks mention to keep your service brake pedal depressed while loading/unloading which means that the "compounding" of air brakes with the parking brake activated would come into play. I also feel its safer to have your brake lights activated when at a stop.
Now they could wire the system so that the parking brake keeps the brake lights on, just like most city transit buses are made. This feature is disconnected when the ignition switch is in the off position.
JC |
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SchoolBusFan
Top Member
USA
1769 Posts |
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thomas86_a
Top Member
USA
4413 Posts |
Posted - 05/15/2005 : 2:07:09 PM
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The old Loadstars had the hydraulic parking brake mounted to the right of the driver over by the manual gear shifter, my first bus had that, then I got an S-1700 that had it to the left and I found it more convenient for applying/releasing.
The air controlled are easier to apply, what is even nicer is the control offered by this company: http://www.55brake.com/
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If you have an International, you NEED customer service. |
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03CV200
Top Member
United States
740 Posts |
Posted - 02/07/2007 : 07:12:46 AM
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| I found it interesting how the CV200 and Vision hydraulic parking brake control worked the opposite of all the other ones. For example on the Vision and CV200, you pulled the lever up to engage, pushed down to disengage, where as Freightliners and Internationals, worked the opposite. (Down was engaged, up was disengaged.) |
-Dave |
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bus724
Top Member
USA
1609 Posts |
Posted - 02/08/2007 : 2:29:15 PM
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First, the state I drive in (CT) requires the parking brake be set and the transmission in neutral (drive if facing uphill) at any times when loading/unloading. With air brakes, this is easy. Hydraulics it's a pain. I assume that this and similar requirements were the reason IC started using the knob-activated hydraulic brakes. I think it's also part of the reason for the controls on the Lucas-Girling brakes Ford used to use.
As far as students messing with the parking brake, most right-hand levers have some type of latch to hold the brake applied until deliberately released. However, this was not always the case. The old Loadstars had the parking brake lever on the right, coming out of the floor next to the gearshift. Some used a latching type, where you had to squeeze the handle to release, but some simply had a lever that was held in place by over-center tension and required only a push to be released. I can imagine those getting accidentally kicked by students getting on or off the bus, presenting a serious safety hazard.
As for the original question, I don't like hydraulic brakes period. As for the best controls, my vote's for red-handle air brakes like they used to have in the old days. |
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mattmcco
New Member
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 07/17/2017 : 10:04:27 AM
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This is the style I have on my 1996 IH 72 Pass Carpenter, and I think one of the new drivers ignored it, drove with the brake on, and completely wore it down, because now, I turn the knob all the way to the right...still no brakes. Have you ever fiddled with it underneath, right behind the motor, to repair it? I'm trying. :)
Matthew
quote:
Originally posted by whe8913
I really like the IHC parking brake levers that are on the left side of the driver. You pull it up to release it and pull it down to apply it. All there is to it. It even has the little ball knob to adjust the tension. Being on the left like that, they were less prone to having kids mess with them, and most non-school bus drivers did not even know what they were- heck we even had some school bus drivers get in a hydraulic brake bus and not figure out how to release the brake. The ONLY thing I did not like about these levers was the fact that they often "rode down" continuously and they always end up resting on my knee, and I have to shove it back up.
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YMCA Bus: "Lucinda"
1993 IH/Carpenter 3800 72- Passenger Bus,
powered by an IH DTA-360 C190TF powerplant running through an AT545 Allison Automatic
"If Willie Nelson had been Rosa Parks, there never would have been a civil rights movement in this country, because he refuses to leave the back of the bus."
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busfan97
New Member
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 08/13/2017 : 09:26:57 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by SchoolBusFan
I like the pull/push knob like most said. The Air operated ones.
I also agree. Our school board only buys buses with air brakes. |
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Topic |
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Parking brake controls
